Playing "Guess Along With John" on the Nats Top 20 Prospects
In addition to my regular tour through FB, Nats Insider and other outposts on teh interNats, I am a fan of John Sickels' site. I've learned a lot about minor leagues from his comments and those of other posters there. As I was looking up Destin Hood for a comment in another thread I found Sickels' assessment of how the Nats Top 20 prospects (as identified last winter) did in the 2011 season. Note that the assessment was done on August 3, so it doesn't quite reflect the players' final stats on the season. The bottom line was that it was generally a good year. The Nats' preseason top 20 prospects and John Sickels' assessment of their 2011 performance:
1) Bryce Harper, OF, Grade A: Hit .318/.423/.554 with 14 homers, 19 steals, 44 walks and 61 strikeouts for Low-A Hagerstown at age 18. Promoted to Double-A, struggled at first but hot lately, hitting .238/.303/.325 with eight walks, 16 strikeouts in 80 at-bats. .297/.357/.486 in last 10 games. Amazing talent.
2) Derek Norris, C, Grade B+: Hitting .207/.365/.423 with 55 walks, 75 strikeouts, 13 homers for Double-A Harrisburg. Hitting for power with high walk rate, as expected, but batting average is too low to be acceptable. Has thrown out 40% of runners but passed ball rate has more than doubled from last year.
3) Danny Espinosa, INF, Grade B: Hitting .226/.314/.421 with 17 homers, 12 steals, 36 walks, 107 strikeouts in 390 at-bats for Washington. I think he'll get better.
4) Sammy Solis, LHP, Grade B: 3.69 ERA with 68/21 K/BB in 71 innings for Hagerstown and High-A Potomac, 73 hits. Throwing strikes as expected, picking up some grounders, doing OK.
5) A.J. Cole, RHP, Grade B: 3.47 ERA with 67/13 K/BB in 57 innings for Hagerstown, 53 hits. Very solid performance, no complaints, command has been sharp.
6) Wilson Ramos, C, Grade B-: Hitting .248/.324/.415 with nine homers, 29 walks, 49 strikeouts in 258 at-bats for the Nationals. I bet the Twins would like to have him back.
7) Robbie Ray, LHP, Grade B-: 1.91 ERA with a 76/30 K/BB in 71 innings, 48 hits for Hagerstown. Could stand to lower the walk rate but otherwise very impressive.
8) Michael Burgess, OF, Grade C+: Traded to Cubs in Tom Gorzellany deal. Hitting .223/.324/.412 with 14 homers, 51 walks, 91 strikeouts in 345 at-bats for High-A Daytona. Still has the power and patience, but other skills have not developed as hoped.
9) Eury Perez, OF, Grade C+: Hitting .271/.306/.312 with 16 walks, 45 strikeouts, 32 steals in 317 at-bats for High-A Potomac. Good speed, but lack of walks and zero power suppress his stock.10) Rich Hague, SS, Grade C+: Season ended after four games for Potomac with a shoulder injury.
11) Cole Kimball, RHP, Grade C+: Threw 14 shutout innings for Triple-A Syracuse, then 14 innings for the Nationals with three runs but an 11/11 K/BB. Out with rotator cuff surgery.
12) J.P. Ramirez, OF, Grade C+: Very disappointing, hitting .225/.277/.3445 with 21 walks, 57 strikeouts in 307 at-bats for Potomac.
13) Chris Marrero, 1B, Grade C+: Hitting .309/.381/.449 with 11 homers, 47 walks, 81 strikeouts in 408 at-bats for Syracuse. A good year, but questions still remains: will he hit for enough power to play first base?14) Steve Lombardozzi, 2B, Grade C+: Hitting a combined .310/.360/.437 with seven homers, 28 walks, 63 strikeouts, 22 steals in 435 at-bats for Harrisburg and Syracuse. Extremely reliable, has made just two errors this year. Deserves a major league trial.
15) Brad Meyers, RHP, Grade C+: 3.46 ERA with 93/11 K/BB in 107 innings combined at three levels, 115 hits. K/BB in Triple-A is 51/11 in 64 innings. Outstanding control.
16) Brad Peacock, RHP, Grade C+: Breakthrough guy, 2.01 ERA with 129/23 K/BB in 99 innings for Harrisburg, 62 hits. Command has slipped some since promotion to Triple-A, 19/12 K/BB in 20 innings, 4.43 ERA but just 12 hits. Always had strong stuff, just needed to refine it. Stock way up.
17) A.J. Morris, RHP, Grade C+: Traded to Cubs. Injured all year.
18) Tyler Moore, 1B, Grade C: .274/.313/.538 with 24 homers, 20 walks, 108 strikeouts in 409 at-bats for Harrisburg. You have to like the power, but I remain suspicious about his plate discipline.
19) Tom Milone, LHP, Grade C: Amazing command, 120/10 K/BB in 117 innings, 110 hits for Syracuse with a 3.62 ERA. Just went on DL with "bicep tiredness." Unfortunate since rumors from Washington indicated he was about to be promoted.
20) Daniel Rosenbaum, LHP, Grade C: 2.59 ERA with 108/41 K/BB in 132 innings for Potomac, 113 hits, 1.62 GO/AO. No complaints here. Just promoted to Harrisburg.
Overall very positive, with Ramos and Espinosa leading the way. Not uniformly so: Derek Norris was a mixed bag. Rick Hague and Cole Kimball got hurt. So did A.J. Morris, but he did it for the Cubs as he was traded along with Michael Burgess, (who under performed - Rizzo points to head) for Tom Gorzelanny. J.P. Ramirez and Eury Perez also both under performed (unfortunately both outfielders, a need position). Still, fifteen of the 20 (75%) of the prospects stayed on track (Solis, Rosenbaum, Moore) or better. So, who will be on the Nationals' "Top 20" prospects going into 2012?
Two of last year's prospects (Espinosa & Ramos) graduated to the Nationals and won't be back; they aren't prospects any more, they are big leaguers. Morris and Burgess were traded. Four more (RHP Peacock, LHP Milone, 1b Marrero, IF Lombardozzi) got September callups but will still be considered prospects and should make it. The top minor leaguers from last year that didn't under perform are also likely to stay on the list unless pushed off by a better prospect - so add Harper, Norris, Solis, Cole, Ray, Meyers, Moore, and Rosenbaum. That's 12 of 20 slots. Who are the other eight slots? Given what will be fierce competition for top 20 slots, Eury Perez and J.P. Ramirez may have played their way out of the Top 20. It's too early to give up on them, but they will have some ground to make up. It's not clear where Hague and Kimball will stand after their injuries, either, so they are wild cards.
Other wild cards include OF Erik Komatsu (23yo picked up for Jerry Hairston, struggled at Harrisburg but did well at AA Huntsville, .294/.393/.416, rated as a C+ prospect for the Brewers last year although at the time of the trade Sickels rated him as a C), SS Zach Walters (21yo picked up for Jason Marquis, .300/.367/.457 combined low and high A ball,rated as a C prospect although at the time of the trade Sickels said he may have moved up to a C+; now in the AFL with Harper and Norris), OF Corey Brown (25yo, picked up too late last year for the 2011 Nationals preview, Sickels did identify him as a borderline B-/C+ prospect going into 2011 where Brown had three bad months at Syracuse and then a few good weeks to get him to a late season callup despite his.235/.326/.402), and IF/OF Matt Antonelli (26yo minor league free agent signing, former #1 (#17) pick and BA #50 minor league prospect who came back from injury to lead Syracuse in OPS with a .297/.393/.460). Since Antonelli is again a free agent I don't know whether he will get rated, but since he was with the Nationals most recently (and I like him) I'm including him.
Others "of note" identified by Sickels that didn't make last year's top 20 but may have done well enough to move up onto this year's list include C David Freitas (22yo, .288/.409/.450 at Hagerstown), OF Destin Hood (21yo, .276/.364/.445 at Potomac), RHP Taylor Jordan (22yo, 9-4 2.48 ERA 1.198 WHIP 6 K/9, 2.2 BB/9 at Hagerstown), IF Blake Kelso (22yo, .293/.357/.365 at Hagerstown), SS Jason Martinson (22yo, .252/.360/.448 with 19 HRs at Hagerstown), OF Randolph Oduber (22yo, .301/.361/.407 at Hagerstown. Atahualpo Severino was also identified as "of note" and he did get a late season callup - but it's hard to see him as Top 20 material. Of this group, Freitas, Hood, Martinson and Oduber may well move up. Hood (along with Solis) was named to Baseball America's Top 20 Carolina League prospects.
Ah, but that doesn't include the Nats' highly touted 2011 draft class! Make room at least for the top four: Rendon, Purke, Meyer, and Goodwin. And that's not counting 3b Matt Skole, the Nats' 5th round pick, who Baseball America named as the #13 NH/Penn League prospect. The 21yo Skole did was lead the league in doubles while posting a .290/.382/.438 in his first season of work. Now it's getting crowded.
Of those 30 players, my guess for Sickels' top 20 (in very approximate order): Harper, Peacock, Rendon, Cole, Purke, Meyer, Norris, Lombardozzi, Solis, Ray, Milone, Meyers, Freitas, Hood, Skole, Moore, Marrero, Walters, Goodwin and Antonelli. This means that Brown, Severino, Perez, Ramirez, Oduber, Jordan, Kelso, and the remaining members of the 2011 draft class will have to be "of note" ... for now. It likely will take at least a C+ to crack the top 20 this year; even with Ramos and Espinosa gone, this is still clearly a minor league system on the upswing.
So ... who's on your top 20 Nationals' prospect list? :-)
::Edited because I forgot to put Purke into my own list! I blame sleep deprivation::
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My guess at Sickels’ list:
1-Harper
2-Rendon
3-Peacock
4-Cole
5-Purke
6-Norris
7-Meyer
8-Hood
9-Goodwin
10-Ray
11-Milone
12-Lombardozzi
13-Solis
14-Marrero
15-Meyers
16-Perez
17-Walters
18-Komatsu
19-Freitas
20-Moore
Doesn’t deviate too much from my personal list here or the ongoing community vote at my blog here.
Check out DC is for Baseball and 2011 Nationals Draft Info!
by what Juneau about that? on Oct 13, 2011 10:44 AM EDT reply actions
No love for Matt Skole? :-)
The Nationals have got to do something about their similar name problem (Zimmerman/Zimmermann; Meyer/Meyers; two players named Peacock)!
I can't believe I forgot Purke *facepalm*
This is what happens when you post after midnight …
Edited; Martinson got cut to make room for Purke
Again, that’s a Homer McFanboy pick; I’m hanging onto Antonelli until he goes elsewhere, dangit!
As for Martinson, you have to like a SS that hits 19 HRs (leading the Suns, btw), but his 33 (!) errors weigh him down. His 144 (!!) strikeouts don’t help, either. He still bears watching, though – his 12.6% BB rate is promising, and he’s still only 22. Derek Jeter famously made 56 errors one year in the Sally league, and he turned out OK.
I’d also put OF Kevin Keyes of Hagerstown in the “players worth watching” list as well. A 7th round pick from last year’s draft (Martinson was a 5th round pick), Keyes was second on the Suns in HR with 17, and did it in 342 PA to 522 for Martinson).
I like Martinson and Keyes better than Moore personally but usually I get roasted when I leave him off my lists :)
I think Antonelli is an ML starter still, but he’s kinda in that awkward ML experience/headed for minor league free agency stage that leads me to leave him off a list like this. Talent-wise, he’s definitely top 20.
Check out DC is for Baseball and 2011 Nationals Draft Info!
by what Juneau about that? on Oct 13, 2011 11:46 AM EDT up reply actions
I personally think Cole will end up being slotted ahead of Peacock
Strictly on a long term potential thing, and some are still criticizing Peacock (future reliever, flat fastball, etc).
So I guess I forsee a top 5 of:
1. Harper
2. Rendon
3. Cole
4. Peacock
5. Purke (if he throws with regained velocity in AFL)
The three most interesting for me are Robbie Ray, Norris, and Solis. I figure prognosticators may end up pretty down on Norris, so I’m curious just how far down. Ray had a fantastic rookie season, but I can’t recall any scouting reports projecting him above back end starter. Then again, maybe he has “projection” left and gets a bump, so I am curious to see that. Then there is Solis, who was supposed to be the fast moving college lefty with rotation upside who really hasn’t moved all that fast. I think he walked more people than expected too, but am too lazy to go look it up so maybe I am just mistaken. Either way, curious about where he fits in.
Oh, and you forgot Kylin Turnbull, the (I think) lefty we got out of an Oregon commitment. I could see him popping up on this list somewhere.
Yeah, Turnbull is a LHP
After the draft Sickels had this to say about him:
Big projectable lefty put up excellent numbers this year, velocity is average but slider and splitter have potential and his velocity could pick up further. Sleeper pick.
I consider him to be worth watching, but I don’t think he makes the Top 20 just yet. If he establishes his secondary pitches in the minors he will, and if his velocity picks up as he fills out he could rise significantly.
I was mostly basing it on Robbie Ray coming in at 7 the Year before
I mean, I figured if a high school projectable lefty was 7 the year before, even with our system overall deeper/better, I could see Turnbull sliding in towards the end of the list for similar reasons.
All interesting stuff
The question is, when do these guys make it to the Majors to stay? Or,… do they ever?
Antonelli is way too old to be considered a “prospect”, IMO. Sorry.
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
Matt Antonelli and I find your lack of faith disturbing ...
I hear you, and I know that baseball is a serious “up or out” business. But it’s the facts of this case that have my attention. He’s clinging to the #20 spot on my list, so query how much of a prospect that makes him. Still, there’s something interesting there. Sickels did offer this about Antonelli when asked whether he might be worth a spot on a 40 man roster:
Yeah actually, if I was a team that had a spot open in the middle infield, I would consider bringing this guy in. At worst, he’s good AAA fodder, but he could end up being useful on the bench, and there is still a chance he could have a surge in his late 20s and develop into the player it once looked like he could become. I think it would be a good risk to take.
Frankly, I think he has more upside than Cora or Hairston at this point, and arguably would provide more benefit to the team than Cora did this year. Which means, of course, that Doghouse would grade Antonelli as at least a B+!
And as for when these guys make it - who knows?
One thing we do know – most of them won’t ever make it to the majors. Which is why piling as much talent in the system as possible is so important (preaching to the choir, I know).
I wish Souldrummer was still posting – I’d like to get his take on this stuff. He was always up on the minor leagues, really sparked a lot of my interest.
I was just thinking that
This is really right up Souldrummer’s alley. Wasn’t he promising to resurface once the minor leagues’ seasons ended?
Brain: "Pinky, are you pondering what i'm pondering?"
Pinky: "Yes, ... wait, ... no, ... never mind"
FWIW, a couple of quotes from Keith Law's chat today on the evil network
Q: AJ Cole or Sammy Solis? Klaw (1:39 PM): Cole. Solis is a back-end guy – 55 FB, 55 CH, below-avg breaking balls.
Also, regarding Matt Purke:
scouts who saw him in instructs said he was “very ordinary.” […] I’m not that optimistic on Purke after the spring he had.
Brain: "Pinky, are you pondering what i'm pondering?"
Pinky: "Yes, ... wait, ... no, ... never mind"
I'd be a lot more concerned about Purke if the reports said that next Spring
It’s not like he’s in mid-season form at the moment. Let him build strength, get some work in during the AFL and get started up the ladder.
He's still recovering strength
However there is no evidence of a permanent injury so he should get back to the stuff he had in 2010, which was dominant.
Aim for the head baby Jesus
Nat's in Baseball America's 2011 Leagues' Top 20 Prospects
Listed by league level then rank:
Brad Peacock (ranked 9th in International League, 4th in Eastern League)
Bryce Harper (ranked 1st in Eastern League, 1st in South Atlantic League)
Derek Norris (ranked 12th in Eastern League)
Destin Hood (ranked 12th in Carolina League)
Sammy Solis (ranked 13th in Carolina League)
A.J. Cole (ranked 11th in South Atlantic League)
Matt Skole (ranked 13th in New York-Penn League)
Here is my first list
Rosenbaum, Martin, Nelo, Smoker, Kobernus, Melson, Martinson, Walters, and Hague were the HM. LMK what you think
1.Harper
2.Rendon
3.Peacock
4.Purke
5.Cole
6.Ray
7.Norris
8.Meyer
9.Goodwin
10.Hood
11.Milone
12.Solis
13.Lombardozzi
14.Komatsu
15.Taylor
16.Marrero
17.Moore
18.Freitas
19.Meyers
20.Perez
MOAR SEVERINO!
HM? Honorable Mention?
Do you have Turnbull in that category as well, or are you waiting to actually see him pitch? Just curious.
I honestly forgot about Turnbull
I guess he could fit in the HM’s, but I honestly forgot about him. Skole I think should also be a HM, along with Keyes. I know just about nothing on Turnbull, and I would like to say that I have never seen most of these guys play. I hope to go to some more Potomac games next season
MOAR SEVERINO!

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