Wire Taps: The 2011 MLB Winter Meetings And The Washington Nationals' CF Search.
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 5, 2011 4:50 PM EST
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FOXSports.com's Ken Rosenthal's (@Ken_Rosenthal) tweeted about the Washington Nationals' search for a center fielder on Sunday afternoon, writing that the, "#Nationals' CF targets include Bourjos, Upton, maybe Pagan if non-tendered. Cespedes also possibility." Peter Bourjos, reports are suggesting, is potentially available because the Los Angeles Angels have a somewhat crowded outfield. The 24-year-old '05 10th Round pick, who hit 26 doubles, 11 triples and 12 HR's in 2011, stealing 22 bases while putting up a .271/.327/.438 slash in 147 games and 552 plate appearances, unfortunately plays center field on a team with Mike Trout in their organization.
Bourjos' name first came up in connection with the Nationals in July, as Washington talked about center fielders before the Non-Waiver trade deadline. In addition to the fact that he's a strong defender, Bourjos is attractive because he won't be arbitration eligible until after the 2013 season...two reasons he'll also require quite a return should the Angels decide to deal him...
• Recent Rumors: Some New York Mets/Bourjos rumors that have been around for a while now were given life again this afternoon when former D.C. GM and current ESPN writer Jim Bowden speculated in an article entitled, "Bowden's Bullets: Bourjos for Wright?", that NY might be able to get a Bourjos/Hank Conger package from LA if the Mets were willing to trade 3B David Wright to the Angels.
The former Nats' GM also mentions the Nationals' interest in Bourjos in the article, writing that in addition to exploring that possibility, the Nats have, "... talked to the Rays about B.J. Upton, but the likeliest target is Yoenis Cespedes. Still, they’re not convinced that they want to meet Cespedes’ asking price, which is in the $50 million neighborhood." According to sources ESPNBoston.com's Gordon Edes's (@GordonEdes) quoted today on the Twitter, that asking price is more like $60 million, "One big-league executive says Cespedes agent telling clubs it will take double Chapman money to sign him That means $60m."
As for Upton, ESPN.com's Buster Olney (@Buster_ESPN) wrote on Twitter today that Tampa Bay was, ".. telling teams they will talk about BJ upton but have to be overwhelmed to move him." What the Rays want in return for Upton might keep the Nationals from pursuing a deal according to Washington Post writer Thomas Boswell, who wrote in a chat with readers this afternoon that after talking to D.C. GM Mike Rizzo recently, "I doubt the Nats will be trading for Upton." The 27-year-old Rays' center fielder, the WaPost writer points out, is a free agent after the 2012 season, "... so the Nats wouldn't give up a significant piece of the current big-league-club puzzle,":
"They'd probably be willing to pay him $5-to-$6M. Money not a problem. But the players the Rays would want in return would probably be prohibitive. So, I got the feeling that, right now, BJ isn't one of the top two players on Rizzo's CF trade list."
The Washington Post writer suggests that if it's not Upton, the Nationals, "... are aiming to make a CF trade for a less high-profile player." The latest reports, however, from a meeting with the press this afternoon in Dallas, have the current Nats' GM Mike Rizzo once again reiterating the fact that the Nats haven't ruled out the possibility of Jayson Werth filling the hole in center field next season, and as MLB.com's BIll Ladson, NatsInsider.com's Mark Zuckerman, and Washington Times' writer Amanda Comak noted on Twitter, they haven't ruled out the possibility of Bryce Harper starting the year in right field.
As the Nats' general manager told reporters earlier this winter, however, in a "perfect world", Werth would be in right and the Nats would acquire a center fielder/leadoff man. If a trade can't be worked out and Yoenis Cespedes proves too expensive, will the "Bryce Harper is ready" lobby get what they want? Or maybe Rizzo's just letting agents and opposing teams know the Nats don't need a center fielder this winter....Speculate away...
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With Jacoby Ellsbury firmly esconced in CF at Fenway and the Red Sox pitching situation
If I were Rizzo I’d call and see if Ryan Kalish or Josh Reddick could be had for a respectable offer.
Assuming you read the MASN report about that possibility...
Forgot about it when writing this up.
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 5, 2011 5:17 PM EST up reply actions
Actually I missed this article
Thanks for the link HG_VA – the author has done more legwork than I have. I only know their raw numbers – I know nothing about their speed, defense, etc.
I knew about Reddick from watching the Red Sox play, and ran into Kalish’s name when I hunted up stuff about Reddick on Sickles’s site.
crazy!
Lefty Ross Detwiler or right-hander Collin Balester might be guys who would interest Boston
I would move both of them for a decent OF prospect. Det is the best bet of the two and is out of options and more than likely in a battle for the 5th spot in the rotation.
Ian Desmond is my hero!
DON'T SAY THAT ON THE INTERNET
IT MIGHT BRING HIS TRADE VALUE DOWN
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
by Jorgath on Dec 5, 2011 6:47 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I could quite happily go for Reddick.
Depends on the asking price.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
You want Kalish, trust me.
"I was a victim of a series of accidents. As are we all."
---Malachi Constant
by The Herndon Kid on Dec 5, 2011 5:55 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
OK, I trust you.
It occurs to me that the fact that I’ve heard more about Reddick does not necessarily indicate GOOD things about him.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
Kalish missed most of the year with an injury, but he is a much better prospect.
But I am all in on this Bourjos rumor. Give me Bourjos!!!
"I was a victim of a series of accidents. As are we all."
---Malachi Constant
by The Herndon Kid on Dec 5, 2011 6:34 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Just Wondering
Would Carl Crawford be available?
The Sox seem to not like him, don’t feel like paying him, and desperately need pitching…
Why would we want him?
He has a $140 million contract(minus this past year), and is not worth that much money. Our outfield consists of Morse, Werth and soon Harper. When LaRoache is moved, then Crawford might fit in at CF, but he is not worth that much money, we have much more important areas to spend that money and we would have so give up some high quality prospects for him. He is no where near worth it.
Skins rule
Crawford also isn't a CF
speed notwithstanding. His best days in Tampa were a a LF.
Brain: "Pinky, are you pondering what i'm pondering?"
Pinky: "Yes, ... wait, ... no, ... never mind"
NationalsPR:
Winter Meetings Mailbag… Bryce A James: How serious are the Nats considering improving through free agency this off season? …
Or can we anticipate this to be more of a developmental yr while playing the game of “lets wait & see what happens” with the guys we have?
Cepedes wants $60 mil.?
I haven’t really followed the stuff on him, but from what little I did I didn’t get the sense at all that he is sure enough of a thing to feel comfortable paying anything like that. Can someone fill me in?
(And it’s sad that Bourjos would in fact raise the team’s OBP…)
by William.Hatheway on Dec 5, 2011 5:38 PM EST reply actions
Well, I want $60 million, too
It’s one thing to want it, and another thing to convince someone to pay it.
The Cubans are starting to remind me of C.M.O.T. Dibbler.
#wikipediaifyoudon’tgetit
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
just curious
what would the community be willing to give up in exchange for Bourjos?
go long with extenze...i do
John Lannan, Brad Peacock, and Tyler Moore?
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
I ask because I'm curious of what his...
perceived value is outside the Angels fanbase
go long with extenze...i do
by angelsownredsux on Dec 5, 2011 5:46 PM EST up reply actions
High enough that people want him, low enough that we think it's possible he's available.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
If I were the Nationals I'd make that trade; not sure from the Angels' side because I don't know their needs
To the original poster: what do you think the Angels’ needs are? The Nationals have good depth in pitching, catching, and (to a lesser extent) middle infield.
In everything but outfielders and power hitting.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
3B, backend anchor, and bullpen...
for next year at least. In the minors, we have weaknesses @3B and pitching depth.
go long with extenze...i do
by angelsownredsux on Dec 5, 2011 5:54 PM EST up reply actions
Correct me if I'm wrong but...
with Anthony Rendon in the minors and Zimmerman in the majors I see 3B as an organizational strength
go long with extenze...i do
by angelsownredsux on Dec 5, 2011 6:00 PM EST up reply actions
It would be...
If that weren’t all of our really high-quality 3Bs.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
so when does the community predict Rendon's ETA to be?
go long with extenze...i do
by angelsownredsux on Dec 5, 2011 6:05 PM EST up reply actions
I'd guess 2014.
Maayyyybeee Sept. call-up in 2013.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
REALLY doubt it.
That’s way faster than anyone but Zimmerman, Storen, and Strasburg.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
Still...I see him not even making ML ST until 2013.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
I guess a mid season callup 2012
but we will all have a better idea after he starts playing some games
MOAR SEVERINO!
I REALLY REALLY don't see that.
Rizzo is…cautious.
I’d say a Sept callup is about as likely as Harper being the ODRF. A mid-season call-up? About as likely as Harper being the ODLF LAST year.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
As advanced as Harper was, he was still 17
Rendon is 21 and much more polished. He should start out in AA after playing ST with the Nats, and then move to AAA by midseason, if at all. After the minor league season he should be called up to be a National.
Skins rule
Remember, Rendon is a #6 overall pick out of college
So was Zimmerman, and he got the September callup the year after he was drafted. With Rendon, the real important things are to prove that the shoulder is healthy and that he can hit with wood.
Which is the exact same time we would start Rendon.
I know there are differences in both player’s situations(injuries, time of signing), but we are in a better situation to call him up without having serious repercussions. Not to mention that if we are in the playoff hunt, he might be t the point where he could really help. btw Zimmerman was the #4 pick.
Skins rule
He automatically goes to ML spring training
Because he signed a major league deal and is on the 40 man.
by Armless Penguin on Dec 5, 2011 8:10 PM EST up reply actions
What those guys have in common is being a high level multi year college player
which also describes Rendon.
Aim for the head baby Jesus
Rendon has so much potential I would not trade him anytime soon for almost anything.
He would have been the #1 overall pick without the injury, he is a born hitter.
Aim for the head baby Jesus
Huh. The trade I suggested was backend anchor, starting/relieving prospect, and 1B prospect
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
Tyler Moore what's his scouting report
go long with extenze...i do
by angelsownredsux on Dec 5, 2011 6:05 PM EST up reply actions
This. Right-handed, AA, adequate defense at 1B.
Projects as a homers-or-Ks-DH ideally, but can play 1B and maybe OF.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
sounds like Mark Trumbo to me
I don’t see him fitting into the org
go long with extenze...i do
by angelsownredsux on Dec 5, 2011 6:17 PM EST up reply actions
Bourjos in his first full season in MLB as a 24 year old
bWAR-5.0
fWAR- 4.3
124K/32BB
The K/BB ratio is pretty alarming . Alot of the value is defensively. Whether you feel his production is sustainable varies depending on who you ask., but his youth suggests sustainability.
go long with extenze...i do
by angelsownredsux on Dec 5, 2011 6:16 PM EST up reply actions
.327
not selling him as a leadoff hitter, but he does have decent offensive skills with some projectability.
go long with extenze...i do
by angelsownredsux on Dec 5, 2011 6:20 PM EST up reply actions
#betterthannygermorgan
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
FIXED
#betterthannyjermorgan
Brain: "Pinky, are you pondering what i'm pondering?"
Pinky: "Yes, ... wait, ... no, ... never mind"
Wow. I can't believe I slipped on that one.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
Bourjos
I think the Angels could get more from the Nats for Bourjos. How about Derek Norris?
Bourjos has gold glove potential in CF, no?
Ray Guilfoyle
www.faketeams.com
www.minorleagueball.com
www.mlbdailydish.com
by Ray Guilfoyle on Dec 5, 2011 6:26 PM EST up reply actions
more dWAR than Ellsbury and he got the GG
the real question is can PB hit enough to win a GG(snark).
go long with extenze...i do
by angelsownredsux on Dec 5, 2011 6:33 PM EST up reply actions
btw would love to have Norris
is he still a catcher?
go long with extenze...i do
by angelsownredsux on Dec 5, 2011 6:34 PM EST up reply actions
interesting
is the defense improved? Lord knows Papa Sosh loves him a defensive catcher.
go long with extenze...i do
by angelsownredsux on Dec 5, 2011 6:40 PM EST up reply actions
Well...
Let’s put it this way. From my eye test, his “catching” ability has improved, but his “throwing-people-out” ability…not so much.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
He threw out 40% of would be base stealers
and his D is much improved, but still not good. Servicable would be my description
MOAR SEVERINO!
Definitely an offensive catcher, but yeah, serviceable is a good word.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
the word on the street
is that 40% CS rate was heavily influenced by his calling a lot of FBs, and the pitchers weren’t necessarily happy about that…
Brain: "Pinky, are you pondering what i'm pondering?"
Pinky: "Yes, ... wait, ... no, ... never mind"
His problem isn't throwing out people.
It’s his receiving in that he gives up too many passed balls. I don’t think Scosia would want a catcher who projects as a below average defensive but OBP machine.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
I was looking at the Rule V list if we wanted to take a flyer on someone in ST
Lee Haydel, Thomas Pham, and Nick Buss are all intersting CF options that could serve as a backup plan, and they could be decent bench players
MOAR SEVERINO!
I'd take a flier on Pham
I see nothing to reccomend Lee Haydel, a 24 year old in AA with .650 OPS.
Thomas Pham is the most interesting as his injuries explain his lack of progress through the minors despite great numbers. Though his eyesight problems seem like an issue.
Nick Buss could also be interesting, but he seems to lack consistency in the low minors. Perhaps he just needs a shot, but this seems like a stretch.
Jordan Danks
Any thoughts on Jordan Danks from Chicago White Sox AAA?
How about Matt Cain?
Baseball insider suggests the Nats trade Desmond, Derrick Norris and Tyler Moore for Matt Cain, who can become a free agent after this year. If we could sign Cain to an extension I’d do that one in a heartbeat. Can’t imagine the Giants would do that deal though…
No
Trading Desi opens up a bigger hole than Cain fills. We have Det as the 5SP, so getting Cain would upgrade the 5SP for Wang, but behind Desi we have no one other than Lombardozzi, who is not ready.
MOAR SEVERINO!
I understand what you're saying, but...
…if Cain will sign an extension that’s a crazy starting rotation for the next 6 years at least, if not more. I’ll gladly pay dues with Lombo’s hickups for a while in exchange.
Doubt it
Royals traded Melky Cabrera because they had Cain ready to take over in CF. I can’t see even KCRGMDM as crazy enough to trade away their only legit CF…
Brain: "Pinky, are you pondering what i'm pondering?"
Pinky: "Yes, ... wait, ... no, ... never mind"
acomak:
Davey Johnson said the name of Japanese left-hander Tsuyoshi Wada has come up in the #nats meetings.
Just say no to soft-tossing JPL LHP!
Brain: "Pinky, are you pondering what i'm pondering?"
Pinky: "Yes, ... wait, ... no, ... never mind"
AdamKilgoreWP:
Davey also says LaRoche is 100 percent right now. Said Marrero, who should return at ASB, is a big loss. Wants a RH platoon to rest LaRoche.
I think ALR needs his rest
preferably in Pittsburgh or Tampa…
Brain: "Pinky, are you pondering what i'm pondering?"
Pinky: "Yes, ... wait, ... no, ... never mind"
[to self]: "Please don't let the Nats be the team w/ the 6-year offer."
@injuryexpert: Nats finally acting. Big offer to cj Wilson. Source tells me like his fit with rotation, team.
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 5, 2011 6:42 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Would you take a 4-year with a 1-year option?
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
Something ridiculous would be my guess.
Enough to make you grumble, but worth it if he actually pans out.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
im nervous on 4 years
but could live with it. 6 is an albatross. With the only benifit that Wilson could go back to the pen when he burns out.
Ian Desmond is my hero!
what's wrong with Wilson?
appeared in the World Series two years in a row, 2.94 ERA last year in the AL, 3.35 the year before, good amount of strikeouts, lefty, only 2 200+ innings on his arm, the next highest is 73 innings.
"How the hell can I make my teammates better by practicing?" - Allen Iverson
by GetThatCurlyW on Dec 5, 2011 6:50 PM EST up reply actions
Unproven for the amount of money he will get
and we have Strasburg and Zimmermann
the money and term is the biggest problem with Wilson
MOAR SEVERINO!
Minor-injury-prone. Not great stamina.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
Good point on the stamina.
+1
but he hasn’t been injured for 2 years now and his arm is fairly fresh. I think signing him would get the Nationals over the hump of being a possible contender to a possible contender this year.
"How the hell can I make my teammates better by practicing?" - Allen Iverson
by GetThatCurlyW on Dec 5, 2011 6:57 PM EST up reply actions
“a possible contender to a possible contender”
a possible contender to a probable contender.
stupid brain-farts
"How the hell can I make my teammates better by practicing?" - Allen Iverson
by GetThatCurlyW on Dec 5, 2011 6:59 PM EST up reply actions
I dont have faith he’ll be there for the long run and be long term effective. More so I think we have good “in-house” options coming throu who could do a better job for less $. In that sense the $ are less the issue and more the blocking of Solis, et al. That’s why im keen on an Oswald type who will be effective and bridge the gap for a few years till the kids are well and truely here.
+1 on the Stras/Zim taking cash away arguement too.
Ian Desmond is my hero!
Don't see Bourjos as a leadoff solution, but a great CF.
Low OBP, high K/BB ratio; therefore, not much projectability. I see him settling into a guy like Drew Stubbs with better defense but less power. Any thoughts?
"How the hell can I make my teammates better by practicing?" - Allen Iverson
If he fits that model
Then we’d have yet another #2 hitter.
I guess we’d just have to keep leading off with ONE of them.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
washingnats:
The #Nats are looking for a left-handed hitter of the bench. They have talked about bringing back outfielder Willie Harris. #MLB
Damn it
Dodgers got Hairston. looks like we are running out of utility options fast.
also, whats with the Dodgers signing everyone, I though they had no money
MOAR SEVERINO!
I'm wondering with reports tonight that Nats wanted Marrero at first w/ LaRoche...
If they are just going to go with Lombo as the utility guy. Stuff Davey said a while back made me think it was the case and the comments on Marrero tend to make me believe even more.
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 5, 2011 7:00 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I though we wanted a better bench?
Lombo and Marrero is not an upgrade over Nix and Ankiel. I want a decent bench for one damn it, and I dont think Lombo will have enough of a bat to be the utilty guy
MOAR SEVERINO!
Neither one is old enough
to pass Davey’s “hairy chest” requirement…
Brain: "Pinky, are you pondering what i'm pondering?"
Pinky: "Yes, ... wait, ... no, ... never mind"
there's still room on that bench
backup catcher – Flores
4th outfielder – Bernadina
Utility infielder – Lombardozzi
right handed bench player – Marrero
left handed power bat –
other power bat or gumptious veteran -
Well, we'd have to acquire Edwin Jackson first...
chuckle
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
I really dont like that bench
Lombo and Marrero have no power, Bernadina has very little, and Flores is a giant ? If something happens to Desmond/Espinosa do you really want Lombardozzi playing everyday, with another Bixler filling in?
#signrentariadobbsandross
MOAR SEVERINO!
Another Damn it
acomakAmanda Comak
#Nationals LHP Sammy Solis saw Dr. Lewis Yocum recently and the team is concerned about his elbow discomfort: http://wtim.es/vtNId3 #nats
MOAR SEVERINO!
Yeah, so there's this...
Currently writing up Nats/Wilson, this will make a good ending…
RT @MLBNetworkRadio: RT @Jim_Duquette: Source- Nats are the team offering 6th year to CJ Wilson.
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 5, 2011 9:06 PM EST reply actions
At least I like Wilson
hes a good player, and will help the team. Just not sure going 6 is smart. Makes trading Det and Balester to the sox that much easier
MOAR SEVERINO!
Fabrication
No chance. I can’t see this happening.
You guys. You lollygag the ball around the infield. You lollygag your way down to first. You lollygag in and out of the dugout. You know what that makes you? Larry!
Yonder Alonso
Also, rumor has it, Yonder Alonso may be available because they an’t find him at bats with Votto in the way. He’d be a perfect fit for the Nats.
I say keep Morse in the outfield, add a lefty 1st baseman. Trade LaRoche, and be done with it.
Who would they want? Well you’d have to imagine that they can’t rake our farm because after all, he is just a farmhand as well.
I think it would be worth the risk.
You guys. You lollygag the ball around the infield. You lollygag your way down to first. You lollygag in and out of the dugout. You know what that makes you? Larry!
That chatter came up a week or so back.
Surprised the Reds would deal him, they’ve been hyping him up for a while, that would be a quick about-face…though I can’t say I follow Reds’ gossip too closely…did he fall out of favor or is he just blocked?
NPUT with some C.J. Wilson links, tweets and stuff…
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 5, 2011 9:46 PM EST up reply actions
blocked
they tried him at 3b and OF, and he is just too round and slow. 1b makes the most sense for him. They have Joey Votto, 2010 MVP, so they really can’t do much with him.
With that said they may try him in the OF again just to wish for the best.
You guys. You lollygag the ball around the infield. You lollygag your way down to first. You lollygag in and out of the dugout. You know what that makes you? Larry!
The Reds want pitching, but my guess is they connect better with the Rays.
Who have pitching and need 1B, DH, and Catcher. All of which the Reds can offer.
Other than that I would offer pretty much any pitcher not named Strasburg or Zimmermann.
The Reds want established pitching, they have a ton of guys with "potential"
so most stuff the Nats can offer is no good. Also, the depth the Reds have at catcher is scary.
Aim for the head baby Jesus
Price?
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
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