Washington Nationals At The 2011 MLB Winter Meetings: Nats Wait For Mark Buehrle's Decision.
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 7, 2011 4:44 PM EST
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Print• Latest Update: 4:45 pm EST: FOXSports.com's @Ken_Rosenthal: "Buerhle to #Marlins: 4 yrs, $58M"
(ed. note - "Hope the Nats had a Plan B.")
The Washington Nationals had an offer on the table for 32-year-old free agent left-hander Mark Buehrle before they traveled to Dallas, TX for the 2011 MLB Winter Meetings at the Hilton Anatole. MLB.com's Bill Ladson (@washingnats) wrote on the Twitter on Sunday night that he had confirmed that, "...the #Nats made an offer to LHP Mark Buehrle," though he noted that he was, "Not sure of the dollar figures." D.C. GM Mike Rizzo's description of Buehrle as, "...a 200-inning machine...who controls the running game, works fast," and would make a good role model for the Nats' young staff during a recent MLB Network Radio interview matched the profile of a pitcher he'd given to reporters earlier this Fall when he'd discussed what Washington was after.
The Nationals, according to the GM, were looking for a "... good leader type of guy that's thrown a lot of innings, that has shown that he can win in the big leagues and [can] really lead our staff... not just by having the best stuff on the staff but by showing how to be a professional and how to be a winner and how to pitch 200 innings in a season many, many times in your career."
The 32-year-old Buehrle, who'll turn 33 this March, threw 205.1 innings in 2011, topping 200.0 innings for the eleventh-straight season, and he finished his 12th year pitching for the White Sox with a 3.59 ERA, 3.98 FIP, 45 walks (1.97 BB/9) and 109 K's (4.78 K/9) in 31 starts and 205.1 IP over which he was worth +3.4 WAR. Buehrle's coming off a 4-year/$56 million dollar deal and is reportedly looking for another 4-year contract with a no-trade clause included. Recent reports said the Marlins were unwilling to give anyone a no-trade. The Nationals' GM, in an interview with the D.C. beat writers told reporters on Tuesday that after giving Jayson Werth a no-trade clause last winter, they would consider do it again for the right player.
Yesterday, Buehrle reportedly trimmed his list of potential destinations to five and reports this morning said he'd cut that list down to three teams earlier today. Shortly after those reports emerged, the word from MLB.com's Bill Ladson among others was that the Nats were one of the final three teams. The most recent reports say that it's getting close to decision time for the soon-to-be-former White Sox' lefty.
"Source: #Nationals, #Marlins finalists for Buehrle," FOXSports.com's Ken Rosenthal (@Ken_Rosenthal) wrote within the last hour, "And if Marlins get C.J., that seemingly would leave Buehrle for Nats." The Texas Rangers were reportedly one of the finalists for Buehrle this winter, but Mr. Rosenthal's FOXSports.com colleague Jon Morosi (@JonMorosi) just reported that he'd talked to Rangers' officials and "Nolan Ryan just told me he expects CJ Wilson and Mark Buehrle to sign with someone other than #Rangers." USA Today baseball writer Bob Nightengale (@BNightengale) too is reporting that, "Mark Buehrle could fall right into the #Nationals' laps if C.J. Wilson goes to #Marlins. Nationals badly want the #WhiteSox veteran."
The latest word from the Nationals, via the Nats beat writers in the Hilton Anatole is that the team made their offer and are waiting for Buehrle's decision. "Nats have made an offer to Buehrle that they feel is 'a legit, fair, market value offer" and they're hoping he accepts," Washington Times' writer Amanda Comak (@acomak) wrote recently on the Twitter. "Mike Rizzo made a 'legitimate, fair, market value' offer to Buehrle," Washington Post writer Adam Kilgore (@AdamKilgoreWP) added, "Seems confident. "I feel good about it."
Did the Nats up their offer to four years? Apparently not. MASNSports.com's Pete Kerzel (@KerzelPete) just tweeted that he'd learned that, "#Nationals offer to Buehrle is three years, between $42-45 million." Did they give Buehrle the no-trade clause he wanted? Will the Miami Marlins make another splash and steal a starter away from their NL East rivals? It seems like we'll know sooner rather than later...
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mlb network reports that
hes down to two teams, the nats and marlins
theres no such thing as stupid questions...only stupid people
Rizzo's going to go back to his hotel room and watch that Strasburg video again
…if you catch my drift.
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
It's a let down
But (like Dunn, Chapman and Soriano before him) may well turn out to be the right move.
Don't forget Greinke
Greinke to me seems to be the best case for the move that is not made being the best made. With free agents, though, it’s always a bit of a bummer because it’s not our money.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
Except that I'm happy with that money going in other places
The draft, international free agents, re-signing players that the team actually develops internally, etc.
Even if it’s not our money, I recognize that it’s not a limitless resource for anyone.
I don't think Buerhle was going to radically hurt us financially over three years
Four years would have been tougher, though.
Of course with the new CBA, it’s harder to overspend in the draft and IFA areas.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
[expletives]
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
+ please don't sign Oswalt...
"Even when I retire and live here in Houston, I don't want to go watch American League baseball." Lance Berkman......LBIMH...
by cat daddy3000 on Dec 7, 2011 4:53 PM EST up reply actions
If you didn't see Zuckerman's report....
He said earlier he doesn’t think Oswalt is the backup.
Can I interest you in a Darvish?
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 7, 2011 4:56 PM EST up reply actions
I want Yu
I need Yu
There AIN’T no way they’re ever gonna sign Yu.
Now don’t be sad,
‘Cause two out of three ain’t bad.
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
by RobBobS on Dec 7, 2011 4:58 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
Damn, that's pretty good...
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 7, 2011 4:59 PM EST up reply actions
Only Yu
can make this game seem right
Only Yu
can make the darkness bright
Only Yu and Yu alone
can thrill me like you do
and fill my heart with love for only Yu
(apologies to the Platters)
Only Yu
can throw this change for me
For it’s true
Yu are my destiny
When Yu throw the ball, I understand
the magic that you do
You’re my dream come true
my one and only Yu, only Yu
Brain: "Pinky, are you pondering what i'm pondering?"
Pinky: "Yes, ... wait, ... no, ... never mind"
by jbg2772 on Dec 7, 2011 5:52 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
+1
I trust Patrick on the Yu thing. Don’t really follow the Japanese leagues that much.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
++1 Very good.
Oh, and
SIGN YU DARVISH!
I wish he’d post already…time to make the move to the Nats.
SIGN YU DARVISH…PLEASE.
C’mon, Rizzo, don your Santa cap and put this awesome pitcher under the Nats’ tree!
"player development" should not be gladiator games. by cat daddy3000 on Aug 6, 2011
by MissB on Dec 7, 2011 6:56 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Trying to find translation, but at least one article says he's aboot to...
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 7, 2011 7:48 PM EST up reply actions
It will have to be Yu, then....
nope, missed Zuckerman and I hope he’s right………. just pencil in Bryce and Flores for Opening Day, skip the FA pitcher$, and I’ll be alright…
"Even when I retire and live here in Houston, I don't want to go watch American League baseball." Lance Berkman......LBIMH...
by cat daddy3000 on Dec 7, 2011 5:02 PM EST up reply actions
Not good. Rizzo's on MLB Network Radio....
And due up on MLB TV shortly. Wonder how pi$$ed he’ll look…
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 7, 2011 4:53 PM EST up reply actions
Wait, I've got counterinformation from SBNationDC on my twitter feed!
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
Of course, it's nebulous.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
Be nice if they provided some context or a source for that assertion...
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 7, 2011 4:58 PM EST up reply actions
You gotta figure that at SOME point the Fish will run out of cash.
Unless they’re printing it down there.
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
Can't imagine they'd still get Fielder...
ing LORIA!!!
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 7, 2011 5:02 PM EST up reply actions
Rizzo just found out on air on MLB Network Radio that they'd lost out...
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 7, 2011 4:57 PM EST reply actions
Rizzo says if report true, "We go to Plan B."
“We’re going to have to move on, we have secondary plans in place. We like the rotation we have…” (typing quick, sorry if not direct quote)
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 7, 2011 5:01 PM EST reply actions
Why does the sound of Plan B
Sound so bad to me.
Nothing rash here Mr. Rizzo…
Just typing up quotes from MLB Network Radio interview...
He seemed to say (and Zuckerman’s tweeted) that they’re likely to go with what they have now.
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 7, 2011 5:16 PM EST up reply actions
For the rotation?
OK, as long as they do something else to shore up their offense instead. Hint hint.
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
Yes, just the rotation, not talk of position players...
Though he did touch on Cespedes again in the interview…
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 7, 2011 5:19 PM EST up reply actions
[no talk]
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 7, 2011 5:19 PM EST up reply actions
Found quotes somewhere of Rizzo dismissing Jackson after the 2010 deadline when his name came up...
And by found them somewhere, I obviously mean I haven’t been able to find them again…
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 7, 2011 5:09 PM EST up reply actions
If Reyes, or hanley come out and say
“Its like a dream team” we are in great shape. Even my lowly Cardinals were able to beat the “Dream Team” I legit am not worried about the Marlins. Is a major league Tom Milone really worth 4 years $58 million. He gives up more than a hit an inning. He is John Lannan with good control.
MOAR SEVERINO!
Lame. That would have been awesome.
Huge fan of Buehrle. 3/45 or 4/60 would have been fine w/me. I thought for years it was CHW STL or retire, dunno what changed for him.
Oh well, when the Marlins are selling 1/4 the tickets by 2013, I guess we’ll all have a good laugh.
Rizzo is getting destroyed by the Marlins
This is turning into a complete disaster for the Nationals. The Marlins are sweeping the board and are leapfrogging bigtime over the Nats. If we thought we were about to move up in the standings forget about it. We are about to be slammed back into fourth place for the next couple years.
No, it isn't.
The Marlins don’t have the money for this. They’re going to be the next Mets/Dodgers financial disaster.
Andy Dalton: An American Hero
by Pardon_My_French on Dec 7, 2011 5:14 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah. All these huge contracts will be voided in about 6 months when the SEC slams the stadium deal
And they’re forced into Chapter 11.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
by Jorgath on Dec 7, 2011 5:15 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
The Mets and the Dodgers
were decimated (almost literally) financially by activities outside of their baseball operations. I haven’t heard anything about the Marlins being in such a situation…?
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
They are being investigate by the SEC for possible shenanigans around the stadium financing
Not sure what the potential impact of that would be, but it can’t be good.
Looks like they may have conned the City of Miami...
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
More than usual, I mean.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
Yes, it is.
Of course the Marlins don’t have the money. They will crash and burn perhaps but not until they’ve beaten the Nats out of a couple wild card spots and maybe even win a championship. If they sign Prince or Wilson it’s over.
Kinda like it was over when the Eagles signed Asomugha?
Andy Dalton: An American Hero
by Pardon_My_French on Dec 7, 2011 5:41 PM EST up reply actions
or when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?
(perhaps I shouldn’t crack that joke on a December 7…)
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
Of course you should
Animal House is no more inappropriate today than any other day!
Brain: "Pinky, are you pondering what i'm pondering?"
Pinky: "Yes, ... wait, ... no, ... never mind"
Dont Over React
Its still early the only player Miami signed that NATS had any interest in was Buehrle. The other moves are solid but if NATS get a starter and a CF it will be great. P.S. Sign Fielder we need that bat
Or Cespedes.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
I'm sure they would have been interested in Reyes for the right money
I probably wouldn’t have been, but the Nats would.
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
rizzo not looking good right now.....
Gotta make a move at some point.
How is he looking bad
do you really want to pay Buehrle 4/60. Making a move just to make a move might be the worst aproach in sports.(see Eagles, Philadelphia)
MOAR SEVERINO!
trust me I like that we didnt offer that much $
Just doesn’t look good to come away empty handed is all im saying. I’m glad we didnt pay Buerhle all that dough
I'd rather they not look good for an afternoon in December
Than for a couple of years at the end of the contract, or when they run out of money and aren’t able to sign one of the kids (Strasburg, Zimmerman, Zimmermann, Ramos, Espinosa, Harper, etc) to an extension.
So ultimately we needed the Fish to sign Pujols
Now they are going to spend 220M toward whatever else their hearts desire. Time to show some trading magic Rizzo.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
First post on here.
Pretty much an amateur when it comes to baseball. But what do you guys think the next move is for the Nats now? Would they make a big move for Fielder with the money saved from Buerhle? Will we make a move for Cespedes? Or Patrick’s man Darvish? Make a trade for a CF like Upton or Jones?
Help a rookie Nats fan out. What happens next?
Follow me on Twitter: @UkRedskin1 feel free to give suggestions on what you'd like to see broken down each week.
Breaking news
Marlins sign every bench player available.
by John Yarchoan on Dec 7, 2011 5:28 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
hey i read your stuff on hogs haven and love it!
i dont see them going with fielder. Its not the type of first baseman Rizzo likes. I see them going with Michael Morse or Adam Laroche. I havent heard too much about Cespedes other than he wants a big contract. and the same with darvish
theres no such thing as stupid questions...only stupid people
Getting a sense that Cespesdes is definitely a target
How often does the GM make a personal scouting trip?
Also, you would think that Pagan, who was just traded by the Mets, would have been an affordable fit unless the organization really had its sights elsewhere…
by John Yarchoan on Dec 7, 2011 5:27 PM EST up reply actions
Pagan would have been a fit, but it looks like the Mets wanted an outfielder in return.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
So tough to tell.
Their next move will be their first. I would have suspected something to have happened before now, however pedestrian.
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
Hey UK - another HH member here who is a fan of your work there
At this point I doubt a big move for Fielder, although I think they stay involved. If the Cardinals sign Pujols and the market for Fielder slips a bit then they could swoop in. Not terribly likely, though. I think they would be involved in the Darvish sweepstakes if he posts, but that’s a total crap shoot and I don’t think Rizzo is ever going to throw caution to the winds and drop a truly absurd bid on the table.
I’m leery of Cespedes, because it’s hard to project a guy who is 26 and yet has never faced major league pitching.
I think they don’t make a trade for Upton until the Rays prove they’re willing to pay him – and probably not even then at this point. The Rays’ GM is a pretty smart operator, and teams always seem to lose trades with them.
Would love to see some Prince up in here
Keep Morse in left, Move Werth to CF, open competition for RF (Bryce is gonna take it over by June anyway). Fielders market seems to be thinning. 5 years, $120 mil?
5 years/120 million is really really wishful thinking. A lot of people thought he was going to cost more than Pujols going into the offseason…
by John Yarchoan on Dec 7, 2011 5:19 PM EST up reply actions
Oswalt?
I know he’s supposedly not the “Plan B” but I always thought he made more sense anyway because he can be probably be had for 2/25 or so, which is both much cheaper and coincides better with the Nationals timetable for when prospects the next crop of prospects will be ready.
Yes, he is a risk with the back concerns, but a healthy Oswalt > a healthy Buerhle. His fastball velocity chart from last year was also encouraging, and would suggest maybe that his struggles mid season are somewhat behind him:
http://www.fangraphs.com/pitchfxo.aspx?playerid=571&position=P&pitch=FA
We have the richest owners in baseball but...
…they act like the poorest. Who cares about the most economical solutions? I don’t. I like what Loria is doing. I wish we were more like that.
Would you have payed more than the Marlins for any of the players they signed?
I know I sure wouldnt have. no need to hit the panic button when you have great depth.
MOAR SEVERINO!
THEN SIGN ME A FRANKING BENCH PLEASE
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
Yeah, that's a bigger issue.
Rizzo needs to find 3-4 wins of improvement in a qualified major league bench.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
YES, PLEASE SIGN A BENCH PLAYER
I dont know if I could take Lombo as the utility guy. Almost glad Marrero got hurt, sounded like he was gonna make the big team.
#signdobbsrossrentaria
MOAR SEVERINO!
"A" bench player?
I want a whole bench of players.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
I wanted Marrero to make the team
A platoon with him and LaRoche wouldn’t have been an embarassment. He showed something during his callup, and I’m never happy to see one of our prospects get hurt.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
Never happy to see a prospect get hurt
but I didn’t see anything other than a slow singles hitter with below average D.
Marrero and LaRoche manning first base?
That would almost certainly generate the lowest offensive production from the first base slot in the Majors.
But I suppose someone’s got to be last.
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
IMO, a bench player needs to have good power
Marrero did not show we that. I am never happy to see an inury, but if it forces the Nats to get a good bench bat than I think it was better for the team
MOAR SEVERINO!
Lerners are cheap?
Werth contract to me ended all of that talk. Rizzo earns the right to spend by spending within parameters. Ultimately, our team will depend on whether our in house talent can perform up to expectations and grow accordingly.
I am far more down about the Solis to Dr. Yokum news than the Mark Buerhle move. When one of your top pitching prospects is sent to a Tommy John specialist that can’t end well.
Rizzo’s earned enough of my trust for me to leave things to the professionals and not question him but so much.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
didn't hear about Solis
haven’t been around enough this offseason I guess
but heard enough during the season to know that Solis is a good one…
I'm bummed about that too,
but then again my optimism about Solis dropped about as far is one could imagine in this last year anyway.
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
Well, maybe not as important as being able to get down a sacrifice bunt...
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
In the crowdsourcing ratings at Nationalsprospects.com he got 3rd ranking
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
More of an indictment about the state of the Nats' organization in pitching?
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
Not really. Solis had a strong high A showing.
2.72 ERA/3.19FIP in 56.1 IP. He was going to start the season at Harrisburg in all likelihood and would have been considered a front line starter in their rotation.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
by souldrummer on Dec 7, 2011 5:42 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
He was advertised as a guy that was going to move up quickly
Discussed on this board last year as a guy that could be helping the Nats in 2012 or even 2011. That clear isn’t going to happen and wasn’t going to happen even if he didn’t get hurt.
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
If he didnt have to wast time with XST and Hagerstown rehab
that I think he could have been in AA last year
MOAR SEVERINO!
all minor league stat warnings apply
but 0.7 hr/9 2.1 bb/9 8.7 so/9 looks fine to me. sure, a 22 y.o. at A/A+, but still
Yes, that was dissapointing news
The news regarding prospective LHSP for the Nationals hasn’t been the best over the last 36 hours.
"Things are going great, and they're only gettin' better..." Timbuk3
To further prove my point about Buehrle being Lannan without the walks here are their stat pages
http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/l/lannajo01.shtml
http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/buehrma01.shtml
Ones getting paid $14.5 million, and the other will get paid around $3 million
/just sayin
MOAR SEVERINO!
Walks are important
And Lannan’s not through Arb years yet.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
Counting on Milone to be ready next year is aggressive
Counting on either Milone, Detwiler, or Peacock to show up is a good thing.
#re-signLivanHernandez (kidding, just kidding)
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
You know...nah...maybe?...
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
and Nolan Ryan without the walks would have been the greatest pitcher ever
Pitcher A = Pitcher B – Walks is not really an insult to me…
Looking at those pages...
…Lannan had WAR of .9, .1, 2.8, and 3.0 from 2011-2008.
Buerhle had WAR of 3.7, 3.5, 4.9, 4.4 the last four years. To me there really isn’t a comparison. One of them has been a fifth starter the last two years and the other has been a solid midrotation guy.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
I think Lannan as been better than a 5th starter
4th starter is where he is on most teams, Burehrle is a 3rd starter on most teams. Is that really worth $10million when you have other spaces to fill. Our pitching was good last year without 1 month of JZimm, 1 year of Stras, and we had to put up with almost a year of Livo. The pitching will be fine, its the hitting that needs help
MOAR SEVERINO!
That pitching also had a tolerable Jason Marquis.
We’re expecting Wang to outperform Jason Marquis at a lower price. Be interesting to see how that pans out.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
I think that
Stas/Peacock, JZimm, Wang, Lannan, Detwiler will be better than
Livo/JZimm, Lannan, Marquis/Wang ,Gorzelanny/Maya
MOAR SEVERINO!
by jeff550 on Dec 7, 2011 5:46 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I agree with that.
I’d like to see another arm in there if we can get one, though. I don’t fully trust Wang, Lannan or Detwiler but so much. I’d like all of them to know that real competition is coming up behind them.
I get the sense that Rizzo believes in that rotation too. If he wasn’t going to overpay for Buerhle, I can’t see him overpaying for Wilson.
Do you guys feel there’s any truth to the Gio Gonzalez rumor? Would you move Peacock and Norris for Gio Gonzalez?
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
In a heartbeat.
But it’ll take more than that to get Gio.
Forget Buehrle get Fielder
Prince at 1B outfield of Morse,Werth, and Harper is going to be a little weak on defense but consider our lineup?? Desmond,Werth,Zimmerman,Fielder,Morse,Harper,Ramos,and Espinosa. That could be NASTY
You think Rizzo's willing to take the risk?
Go ahead, make my day.
by ilikeburritos on Dec 7, 2011 5:39 PM EST up reply actions
Adam Jones!
Trade for him now! Look, I’m not saying we should have outspent the Marlins on Buehrle but there better be a Plan B. We have only one pitcher with any post season experience and that’s Wang with one game experience. We need a vet like Buehrle or, now, Oswalt. And why not go after Fielder? Just because we have LaRoche under contract for one more year? Maybe the Lerners aren’t cheap but they are richer than Loria and he’s outspending them. if they let Fielder go to the Marlins then this is a total disaster.
That's assuming that we can get him for a price that doesn't wreck our team
See Zack Greinke.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
Also, Loria's outspending them by spending money he conned out of someone.
The SEC is going to be bringing a vary beeg hammer.
"I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you."
-Leslie Nielsen, Airplane
My eyeball tells me he's a pretty good defender,
and his OPS+ the last three years has been 109, which is a lot better than mediocre.
I frankly am surprised he hasn’t excelled more than he has — he seems to me like a very gifted ballplayer.
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
oh, that's weird
I thought I had double-posted the above remark. Hence the follow-up remark.
Just in case you didn’t follow my train of thought there.
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
I hate UZR.
It’s so incredibly unstable. He went from a half-win positive to over a win negative in one year. That tells me the problem is not him, it’s the statistic.
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
Funny, you had a different opinion of UZR when discussing Melky Cabera.
Then it was all important.
Specifically his problem with UZR is how it applies to first basemen I’d imagine or the general notion of how important first basemen are defensively, but I imagine he’ll drop in a second. For an outfielder, range seems to be more easily quantifiable.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
Really?
I hardly EVER bring up UZR unprovoked. Mostly because I hardly ever look at FanGraphs unprovoked. I might have mentioned his dWAR, but I don’t recall ever saying anything like I thought it was the most important thing.
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
Apologies for trying to speak for you above.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
I apologize
I went back a looked at the comment thread. You rejected Melky because you thought Bernadina could match his production, which seems to be boundless optimism.
Another commentor then replied to my response to your comment bringing up UZR. I clearly, I was wrong.
Bernie matching Melky
mostly pessimism about Melky; not so much Bernie optimism.
Rob
-- In baseball we trust.
The Lerners are incredibly wealthy.
It won’t wreck our team. It can’t possibly wreck our team.
+ jeff550 +
Buehrle for his 33, 34, and 35 seasons for 14 million plus means you either get a slight upgrade on a 2 million lannan or you keep both and block any possibility of giving a shot to the gazzilion young arms they’ve spent high picks on for the last many years.
As I explicated in a post elsewhere the other day, when you take a clear “talent” in producing unearned runs into account, both are weaker than they appear even if you dismiss FIP, etc., and so it would be just stupid to pay that for him.
I really, really want to have confidence in this management, but J. Zimm plus others for Greinke was just wrong, and this was too…
by William.Hatheway on Dec 7, 2011 5:45 PM EST reply actions
Greinke was overrated.
But Buehrle is solid. I’ll settle for Oswalt – to teach the youngsters how to win. I don’t want to block our young talent but they need more seasoning anyway. If we’re still rebuilding then fine – you hold off. But we’ve been told that we’re supposed to actually compete next year and we’re being outclassed by one of our biggest rivals. That’s not how you compete.
Lot of season left to be played.
And they may have lost the offseason by keeping BB, much as I hate to say it. A lot of institutional progress was squandered in the first quarter of the season.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
Very true...
The 2011 Philadelphia Eagles are a great cautionary tale for the 2012 Marlins.
Loria knows he has to do everything possible to remake the club in no time at all, so a lot of players are just more valuable to him than to anybody else.
I’m fine with not trying to keep up with that kind of spending.
It hurts to have Evil Loria breaking the bank to rob players
That man lives in Infamy among those who dug the Expos.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
Loria is playing with Monopoly money right now
and trying to stay a step ahead of the SEC forcing him to open his books. IF that happens, and the Feds can show that he defrauded the City of Miami & Dade County to get the stadium deal, the entire house of cards crashes down. Loria stripped of the franchise, led away in cuffs to face Federal charges of fraud… that could be Selig’s final legacy.
"Things are going great, and they're only gettin' better..." Timbuk3
Then hire Oswalt as a pitching coach and spend elsewhere
because that would be better than an aging pitcher with a bad back, which isn’t really a recipe for “competing now”
by William.Hatheway on Dec 7, 2011 5:58 PM EST up reply actions
@AdamKilgoreWP Adam Kilgore
Word is, the Nats’ offer to Buehrle fell short in both AAV and number of years. Their target now is Roy Oswalt.
Seems to direclty contradict Zuckerman.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
Zuckerman also shot down the Gio Gonzalez rumors, saying the A’s want too much.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
I usually don't get into the offseason baseball conversations that much
because I don’t consider myself nearly knowledgeable enough to provide any real insights or well-informed recommendations, but I would say that I feel fine with sticking largely to our players to build the rotation. We should focus on strengthening the offense.
But seriously, it feels like every player this offseason has gone to the Marlins. What gives? And how do they have this much cash to spend?
They've been pocketing revenue sharing $'s for years...(sorta kidding, MLB did force them to spend more)...
So they haven’t been spending on the team and they just sold a stadium full of suites and got the city to build them a new stadium. Read someone joking/speculating that Loria will now sell team and stick someone else with all the future costs.
#floria.
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Dec 7, 2011 6:14 PM EST up reply actions
LORIA ... [SPIT!] FOREVER!
If he’s involved in any transactions, you know he’s gaming (family-friendly word used but still not appropriate for Loria) somebody. Excrable human being.
Gack!
"player development" should not be gladiator games. by cat daddy3000 on Aug 6, 2011
by MissB on Dec 7, 2011 6:47 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I don't really want to go after Wilson
To compete with the Marlins, Rangers, and Angels it’s going to take quite a pretty penny.
Waiting to bang my drum in parades for the Nats and Caps.
MLBTR says there are 3 offers out there on Pujols, even though the Marlins are out...
Who could they be? (Not suggesting Nats, just asking an honest question)
The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant compared to the power of the Morse
by Nationalpastime9 on Dec 7, 2011 6:28 PM EST reply actions
The prior players were Marlins / Cards / Cubs...
so with the Marlins reportedly out of the running for Puhols, maybe one of the Angels / Mariners / Rangers? Or maybe MLBTR just forgot to drop the Marlins from their list.
"Things are going great, and they're only gettin' better..." Timbuk3
According to Jon Morosi on Twitter
The Marlins are now going hard after Fielder.
Also, thanks to the guys who replied to my earlier comment.
Follow me on Twitter: @UkRedskin1 feel free to give suggestions on what you'd like to see broken down each week.
He also said that the Mariners are going after Fielder.
Not sure if the Mariners will have the money to sign him or if he’s willing to play for Seattle. And I’m not sure if one player will change a completely abysmal lineup.
Go ahead, make my day.
by ilikeburritos on Dec 7, 2011 7:00 PM EST up reply actions
Some Nats comments in this video with Law etc.
Start at about 15 minutes
http://www.vokle.com/events/38484-espn-dot-com-at-the-winter-meetings
You guys. You lollygag the ball around the infield. You lollygag your way down to first. You lollygag in and out of the dugout. You know what that makes you? Larry!
was a question
but they skipped it bastahds
You guys. You lollygag the ball around the infield. You lollygag your way down to first. You lollygag in and out of the dugout. You know what that makes you? Larry!
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