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Washington Nationals' Trade Deadline Chatter: The Mike Rizzo Show On 106.7 The FAN In D.C.

Thursday night, after the Nats' fifth straight loss, Nationals' GM Mike Rizzo appeared on the Mike Rizzo Show on 106.7 the FAN in D.C., talking to Overtime host Danny Rouhier and answering questions from fans over the phones and on Twitter. As they came back from the first break, Rizzo was asked under what circumstances he'd consider trading high-end prospects for a starter like the Rockies' Ubaldo Jimenez?

Background: ESPN.com's Jayson Stark, in an article entitled, "Daily Rumble: Trade Ubaldo Jimenez?", wrote that several teams were in talks with the Rockies to see if the 27-year-old right-hander Ubaldo Jimenez was available. "[An] executive of one club involved in these talks says he was told that two National League teams," who hadn't been identified, were involved, and, "Other clubs [were] conjecturing that one of them almost certainly is Washington." 

Star-divide

Mike Rizzo: "You really have to weigh the impact of Ubaldo Jimenez and what you're giving up. Now if you obtain, believe me, a quality top of the rotation starter like Jimenez, but if you leave three or four holes open in other parts of your ballclub it really doesn't make sense. Now if you're at the point in your franchise that you have the depth to fill in some of those three or four players that you're going to have to give away for such a great asset like Jimenez, then you're able to make those kind of trades. But I think to create three or four holes if you don't have the depth for it to get that one starting pitcher is a little short-sighted in the Nats' short history of being here in Washington." 

"Michael Morse has done enough to solidify himself to hit in the middle of [the Nats'] lineup that's for sure," Mike Rizzo said when asked if the 29-year-old hard-swinging outfielder/first baseman would remain at first when Adam LaRoche returned from shoulder surgery in the second year of his 2-year/$16M dollar deal next year. "In a perfect world we get the Adam LaRoche that we signed that's a 25-HR, 100-RBI Gold Glove [calilber first baseman]," Rizzo continued, "Mike Morse goes to left field and is a 25-35 HR, 100-RBI left fielder and we've really replaced two powerful bats in the lineup." 

• Clippard and Storen Trade Talk?: 

Background: Though FOXSports.com's Ken Rosenthal, among others including MLB.com's Bill Ladson, has written that, the Nats are, "...unwilling to trade closer Drew Storen and reluctant to trade All-Star setup man Tyler Clippard," as the bow-tied FOXSports.com writer did in article entitled, "Nats, Twins have discussed Span", both pitcher's names have popped up repeatedly as the Deadline's approached. Is Drew Storen part of a package to get Denard Span from the Twins? Will the Nats have to part with Tyler Clippard to pry B.J. Upton from the Rays' outfield? Or Michael Bourn from the Astros? What will it take to make the Nats' GM move a pitcher like Clippard or Storen?

Mike Rizzo: "I think, Danny, it's kind of the flipside of the earlier questions about Jimenez. To flip a young controllable bullpen piece like a Clippard or Storen or even a young everyday player like an [Ian] Desmond, or a [Danny] Epsinosa or [Wilson] Ramos, and believe me we get inundated with calls about those players, and for us to do something like that it would really have to impact us greatly. It would have to be a long-term asset for us in a position that we don't have great depth. It would have to fill at least one whole on the ballclub not only for 2011 but for the long-term and that would impact us more than giving up one of those great young, controllable, inexpensive assets like those players we just mentioned."

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“I think to create three or four holes if you don’t have the depth for it to get that one starting pitcher is a little short-sighted in the Nats’ short history of being here in Washington.” Then explain the Greinke trade, Mike!

Jayson Werth Triple Slash Watch: .219/.326/.366

Morspinosa HR Watch: Danny 17, Michael 17
(Figures accurate through 28 July)

by hscer on Jul 29, 2011 7:34 AM EDT reply actions  

Greinke trade? Did the Nats pick him up? I don't remember that trade

Last I saw he was pitching for the Brewers.

Two points about that: (1) we don’t know exactly what was on the table for that trade; and (2) even if you assume the maximum (JZim, Desmond plus whatever) it’s just possible that if that was the terms and conditions Rizzo was reminded of the downside of such a trade. A downside he laid out in the transcript above.

That shouldn’t stop a team from making trades, though. Everyone remembers the Bartolo Colon type trades that end up being disastrous for the team that acquires the one player. Almost no one remembers the many, many times the prospects that are traded for a player don’t make it. The Cardinals traded three prospects to the Athletics for Mark McGwire: Eric Ludwick (starter, eventually converted to the bullpen; career ERA 8.35), T.J. Mathews (viewed as a potential closer, he became a career middle relief guy with a 3.82 ERA – the star of this class) and Blake Stein (another starter, 21-28 career record, 5.41 ERA). McGwire played five seasons in St. Louis, hit 220 HRs, drove in 473 and his OPS was 1.111.

Remember when Justin Maxwell was a five tool OF, a local boy who tore up the minors? And John Patterson was on the brink of stardom? Imagine the fan reaction if players like that had been packaged with Brad Wilkerson (got Wilk?) for a solid #5 or #6 hitter that played the oufield – a J.D. Drew or someone like that. Fans would have rioted – and the trade would have been great for the team.

Anyone (including all of us) can look at a trade in hindsight and judge it. The GM has to do so looking forward – it’s a much trickier business.

by d_c_guy on Jul 29, 2011 9:33 AM EDT up reply actions  

I wonder

How the players feel about being called "young, controllable, inexpensive, assets "?

I bet they don’t care, but it sounds funny.

by HarmonK on Jul 29, 2011 7:38 AM EDT via mobile reply actions  

For that matter...

wonder how they like beign called “pieces.”

Let’s channel DeForrest Kelley here: “We’re talking about human beings, Mr. Spock!”

by Elvin Unseld on Jul 29, 2011 11:44 AM EDT up reply actions  

"...you pointy-eared, green-blooded.....!"

(BTW, does alternate universe, evil Rizzo wear a goatee?)

by ricksnats on Jul 29, 2011 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

No, but he does sport eyeliner

and has his face lit weirdly…

Brain: "Pinky, are you pondering what i'm pondering?"
Pinky: "Yes, but isn't a cucumber that small called a gherkin?"

by jbg2772 on Jul 29, 2011 12:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Rizzo

I agree with Rizzo’s logic and his strategy. Sometimes I think these gms flip players just to play their game rather than help the team.

by JamesFan on Jul 29, 2011 8:38 AM EDT reply actions  

Morse

Please dont move him back to LF. That is all.

by G8RB8 on Jul 29, 2011 8:45 AM EDT via mobile reply actions  

[Dreaming of a Gomes-Hairston-Morse OF...]

No, wait, that’s a nightmare!

"I don't believe in luck, but it was just one of those things where it wasn't really skill, either." --Jerry, jr.

by Doghouse on Jul 29, 2011 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions  

Neither of these descriptions are accurate.
“In a perfect world we get the Adam LaRoche that we signed that’s a 25-HR, 100-RBI Gold Glove [calilber first baseman],” Rizzo continued, “Mike Morse goes to left field and is a 25-35 HR, 100-RBI left fielder and we’ve really replaced two powerful bats in the lineup.”

Morse, currently enjoying his career year, is on pace for 27 homers and 93 RBI, though he has just two home runs in July. Can we let him actually accomplish something before setting unrealistic expectations? LaRoche has driven in 100 RBIs once in his career, and it was 100 exactly in 2010.

I like the job Rizzo has done for the most part, but the oversell he does on these guys in the media is something he learned from his predecessor and it drives me crazy. casual fans hear this [stuff] and think it’s true because they either won’t take the time to look it up themselves or don’t read quality independent analysis like you find here (or other places).

Your voice of doom and gloom. Read more at natsnewsnetwork.blogspot.com

"Nobody’s got a monopoly on good writing, or the facts. If you can come up with one or the other or (ideally) both, you’re in the club." --Rob Neyer, Feb. 2, 2011

by Dave at District Sports Page on Jul 29, 2011 10:29 AM EDT reply actions  

Rizzo's stunning inanity

Morse came around at bat began when he was moved to 1b, where he is clearly more comfortable than he was in LF. “In a perfect world,” this move could have been attempted, or at least contemplated, before shelling out $14M for LaRoche.

"On my tombstone just write, 'The sorest loser that ever lived.'" - Earl Weaver

by Whupass on Jul 29, 2011 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions  

Dave posted before I finished this, and said it much better than I was going to

2010 is the only time LaRoche had the numbers to which Rizzo refers (25 HR, 100 RBI). His career (as a full-time player) by-year show not-bad, but not quite that:

2005: 20 HR, 78 RBI
2006: 32 HR, 90 RBI
2007: 21 HR, 88 RBI
2008: 25 HR, 85 RBI
2009: 25 HR, 83 RBI (combined PIT/BOS/ATL)
2010: 25 HR, 100 RBI
Average: 25 HR, 87 RBI

If LaRoche comes back soon, he’d need to hit 8-10 HR and drive in 30-35 runs to match the pace.

Brain: "Pinky, are you pondering what i'm pondering?"
Pinky: "Yes, but isn't a cucumber that small called a gherkin?"

by jbg2772 on Jul 29, 2011 10:32 AM EDT reply actions  

RBI is often a function of whether there is someone on base

Which hasn’t been the Nationals’ strong suit. If the Nationals can manage to have five guys good for between 20-30 HR’s in a year (LaRoche, Espinosa, Zimmerman, Morse, Werth) that would be pretty good. They have a catcher who is good enough offensively (although I wish he’d stop trying to mash the ball 500’ and just hit). If they can get a SS and a CF that are decent defensively while being able to get on base, that lineup really has potential even in 2012.

IF.

This is why I’ve become agnostic on moving Desmond. I like him, and hope that he has a good career. But if the Nationals could move Desmond and Clippard and a second tier prospect for Denard Span, I’d be in favor of that deal. Span (.366 career OBP) fills one spot at the top of the order, leaving the door open for someone else (for Lombardozzi? maybe … ). After starting the season with Morse-Span-Werth in the OF, whenever Harper is ready to come up the team could dump LaRoche for a bag of baseballs and move Morse to first.

by d_c_guy on Jul 29, 2011 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

yeah, RBIs more a function of opportunity than skill...

but also a function of SLG and consistency. LaRoche has proven good, but not great, thoughout his career as his SLG numbers prove. the thing that gets me is the oversell. when did it become bad to be merely “good”? as we’ve seen with Flores, though, LaRoche’s return is far from a given.

dcguy, the guys you list as being 20-30 homer guys, IMO, should be listed as 20-25 homer guys, with the possible exception of a healthy Zimmerman (he’s not yet, BTW). i think there’s a big difference between calling someone a 25 homer guy and a 30 homer guy. might be just my thinking, but there’s a difference between “pop” and “power”.

Morse hasn’t done it yet. Werth had one 30+ year and I doubt we ever see anything close to that again. LaRoche’s max is 25. and as much as I love Danny, I think he’ll never make enough consistent contact to hit more than 20 on a regular basis. i think he’s going to settle into a nice 15-20 range with the same number of steals and play gold glove defense.

again, all opinion. yours mileage may vary. consult a physician if rash develops. don’t try this at home.

Your voice of doom and gloom. Read more at natsnewsnetwork.blogspot.com

"Nobody’s got a monopoly on good writing, or the facts. If you can come up with one or the other or (ideally) both, you’re in the club." --Rob Neyer, Feb. 2, 2011

by Dave at District Sports Page on Jul 29, 2011 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

Agreed, but those were the numbers Rizzo was throwing around

closed course with trained professionals. past performance is no guarantee of future yields.

Brain: "Pinky, are you pondering what i'm pondering?"
Pinky: "Yes, but isn't a cucumber that small called a gherkin?"

by jbg2772 on Jul 29, 2011 11:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don't think we're that far apart in how we look at it

And I agree, the oversell is a problem for Rizzo – but it’s a common problem for GM’s after a deal (whether a trade or a signing).

My point is that a lineup with two tablesetters in front of five guys with “pop” plus whatever Wilson Ramos brings to the table has the potential to be above average. One of my favorite teams ever was the 1998 Yankees – in the “year of the HR” they had no one on the team with more than 29 HR (Tino Martinez) – but they had ten guys on the team with 10+ HR and led the league in runs scored. You don’t need a Prince Fielder type to have a plus offense; it merely helps. I’m NOT saying that the 2012 Nationals would be on a par with the 1998 Yankees and lead the league in runs. But on paper they could be a plus lineup without Fielder and before Harper arrives.

But they need the tablesetters, and that’s always been an issue for this team.

by d_c_guy on Jul 29, 2011 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don't disagree at all.

This team’s biggest glaring need — if Michael Morse is really a 25 homer guy — is a .360 OBP leadoff hitter. that, and getting Desmond to cut his swing down and try to use all fields instead of being pull happy trying to hit homers. he’d be a quintessential No. 2 guy if he could learn to do this, IMO.

Your voice of doom and gloom. Read more at natsnewsnetwork.blogspot.com

"Nobody’s got a monopoly on good writing, or the facts. If you can come up with one or the other or (ideally) both, you’re in the club." --Rob Neyer, Feb. 2, 2011

by Dave at District Sports Page on Jul 29, 2011 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

Well, maybe

But in the past, Desmond has proved to be a much better hitter when he pulls the ball. He actually does put the ball in play about as often opposite field as he does pulling the ball, but his power and average are much higher when he goes to left.

Rob

-- In baseball we trust.

by RobBobS on Jul 29, 2011 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

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