Wire Taps: Washington Nationals' John Lannan Trade Chatter Continues...
by Patrick Reddington on Feb 10, 2012 12:02 PM EST
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PrintAt the end of an appearance on MASN's Mid-Atlantic Sports Report which focused on his recent article about Bryce Harper's thoughts on making the Opening Day roster, MLB.com Nats beat writer Bill Ladson talked about the chances of Jayson Werth ending up in center with Harper in right and the possibility of the Washington Nationals making a trade for an outfielder this Spring. Though Mr. Ladson said Werth could play center and will see time there in Spring Training, he added, "... it would not surprise me if [Nats' GM] Mike Rizzo tried to acquire a center fielder and then we'll see Jayson Werth back in right and Bryce Harper back in the minors."
"Now, is John Lannan out there?" Mr. Ladson asked rhetorically, "There's no question in my mind, although Mike Rizzo will deny it, that John Lannan will be traded, and I think he'll be traded for a center fielder or a position player." Mr. Ladson's not alone. ESPN.com's Jayson Stark on Thursday, in an article entitled, "Big names who might be on the move", listed the Nats' 27-year-old left-hander as one of five players, "... whose names are already being floated -- and could legitimately get traded between now and Opening Day."
The veteran of five MLB seasons finished the 2011 campaign with a (10-13) record, a 3.70 ERA, 4.28 FIP, 76 walks (3.70 BB/9) and 106 K's (5.17 K/9) in 33 games and 184.2 IP, earning himself a raise through arbitration (though he lost his case) from the $2.75M he made in 2011 to a $5.0M salary for 2012. Having added left-hander Gio Gonzalez to the rotation this winter and signed right-hander Edwin Jackson to an already crowded rotation that includes Stephen Strasburg, Jordan Zimmermann, Ross Detwiler and Chien-Ming Wang, Mr. Stark suggests that, "they don't especially need [Lannan]."
FOXSports.com's Ken Rosenthal and Jon Morosi suggested the Nationals were "aggressively shopping" the left-hander before the Nats agreed on what is reportedly a 1-year/$11M dollar deal with Edwin Jackson. ESPN.com's Mr. Stark writes that, "... the Nationals are already dangling Lannan to every team they think has even a remote need for a 27-year-old left-handed innings-eater," while mentioning Pittsburgh, Baltimore, Boston and New York (NL) as teams that might have a need. When asked how committed the Nationals were, "to dealing Lannan," a rival executive who'd spoken to the Nats told the ESPN.com writer, "100 percent."
"We're certainly always open to [making] a deal that makes sense for us, and if it can improve the ballclub," D.C. GM Mike Rizzo told reporters in responding to a question about the trade rumors after the Jackson signing. "We did not acquire Edwin Jackson to trade another starting pitcher. If in Spring Training, or before Spring Training a deal comes up that we can't pass up that positively impacts our ballclub we'll definitely be open-minded about it." As the Nats' general manager pointed out at the time, however, with Strasburg, Zimmermann and Wang having dealt with injuries recently, and Ross Detwiler as yet unproven at the major league level, the Nationals thought they had an "innings shortage" before acquiring Gonzalez and Jackson. Will Washington deal the pitcher who led the team in innings in three of the last four seasons?
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I don't know if this means anything...
but right when I pulled up this article, the Grateful Dead’s “He’s Gone” came on my iPod.
Garcia still manipulating the cosmos.........
Lannan just gets caught in the backwash….
"...I don't want to go watch American League baseball." -Lance Berkman....
I wanna watch the "... tape-measure-testing, laser-throwing, eyeblack-oozing baseball cyborg."
by cat daddy3000 on Feb 10, 2012 12:41 PM EST up reply actions
Weird
Woody Guthrie’s “So Long It’s Been Good To Know You” came up on my iPod when I started reading the article.
Woody and Jerry must be sitting around picking on the other side.
It's coming!
Nationals:
#Nats pitchers and catchers report to Viera in just 9 days! That makes today #TruckDay in the District atmlb.com/z4sLhx
Oooooh! How many baseballs will they have this year?
What’s the total weight of the cargo?!??!?!?
#thisguyloveshimsometruckday
Vivian Jaffe: "Have you ever transcended space and time?"
Albert Markovski: "Yes. No. Uh, time, not space... No, I don't know what you're talking about."
by Patrick Reddington on Feb 10, 2012 12:56 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Still don't understand the necessity of dealing Lannan
The state of our current rotation:
3 SPs coming off severe arms injuries within the last year and a half
2 SPs notorious for their control problems
1 SP who has never proven himself to be effective as a starter in the major leagues
What’s the harm in having a very good #6 or 7? Especially, when Lannan still has an minor league option? At least, wait until the deadline to trade him. By that point we’ll be much more sure of how Wang and Strasburg are holding up.
Can't agree with all of that
1 SP is coming off a SEVERE arm injury. TJ is done so much and has such a high success rate that it isn’t so severe to pitcher’s careers anymore. It’s almost becoming TOO normal.
Jackson and Gio both need to work on their control, but Lannan also walks lots of guys as well so does that raise questions of his control?
I assume you mean Detwiler is the one who isn’t effective as a starter. I witnessed him pitching as a starter last year and he really is putting it all together. Maybe it took him a bit more time to bring it all together at the major league level but a guy who is 25 and has a mid-nineties sinker coming from the LEFT side is a big plus to have. Essentially with a rotation of Strasburg, Gio, Zimm, Jackson, Det you have 5 straight power arms. If you develop these young guys, within three seasons, you have the oldest at 31 but everyone else in there prime and most likely the best rotation in all of baseball. That is impressive.
I’d move Lannan if you bring back the missing piece, ala, a CF. If you can’t bring back anything better than a Bernadina/Cameron style player though, I’d hold off.
Name a number between three and five.
.............
.............
Threeve.
Valid points
TJ is still a very serious injury. Recovery becoming more reliable, but anything that requires you to miss an entire season and then strictly limit your use after that year is pretty serious to me.
And I didn’t mean for it to be an insult against Gio or EJax by pointing out their control problems, I’m just saying it is a risk that should be considered.
Yes, Detwiler is the unproven starter. He has all the “stuff” in the world, but has never shown an ability to put it all together, especially over extended period of time in one game. Detwiler averaged 5.6 IP per start last year. He must improve that if he wants to be a good starter. I don’t think being a long reliever will stunt that, but we don’t really have any other options I guess.
My overall point, which I touched upon below this post, is what separates the good rotations from the bad is their depth. The Red Sox didn’t have much after Buchholz got injured, and they were forced to give 17 starts to Andrew Miller and Kyle Weiland. That cost them making the playoffs.
The Phillies, on the other hand, had good back ups. Kyle Kendrick, Joe Blanton and Vance Worley were rather good options to have at the back of the rotation. It proved very handy after Oswalt battled injuries at the end of the season.
We have a great rotation for sure, but there’s still a lot of question marks, and we should have a plan in place for when one gets injured (not if).
I also don’t think Lannan will bring much of anything in return. If there was a strong market for average SPs, we’d have never signed Edwin Jackson to a 1/$11mil deal!
Edwin Jackson isn't an average starter
And Ross Detwiler is better than you’re giving him credit for. Detwiler, is tall, young, left-handed and throws hard which isn’t exactly something found on every street corner. The difficulty there is that tall pitchers can take longer to put it all together. I think that eventually Detwiler will be the team’s 5th starter. As for him being someone who has never proven himself an effective big league starter, the same thing could have been said this time last year for Jordan Zimmermann.
As for Edwin Jackson, he is not by any means an average starter. While his overall averages may average out be slightly above average he has shutdown stuff, but at times minor league control. However, he also eats innings and turns in about a gem a month. Essentially he’s Livo with much better stuff, which is not at all average. John Lannan is average, Edwin Jackson is not. The fact that he posted fWARs of 3.8, 3.8 and 3.6 over the last three years show that he’s worth about three and a half more wins than replacement level pitcher which is pretty good.
Ross Detwiler will have a breakout year...Believe It!...and I'm serious this time!
I didn't say he was
I said Lannan was. My point was there was no demand for an above average starter like Jackson, so why would there be for a significantly lesser SP in Lannan?
I’ve questioned before your contention that tall pitchers take longer to develop… that aside, at 6-5, Detwiler isn’t all that tall, as ML pitchers go.
When I think of “tall” ML pitchers, I think 6-7, 6-8, and up.
Also, and this is just a minor bone to pick, I find it odd how on this site and others, posters evaluate players based almost entirely on their saber-numbers and then turn around and make statements like your “Detwiler is better than you give him credit for” when the numbers don’t support it.
Personally, I have “hope” for Detwiler based on what I see, but I don’t see how one could make such a definitive statement about his abilities based on past overall performance.
Saber vs. scouting
While I believe in Sabermetrics, they must be used in the correct context. Trying to use sabermetrics to gauge the future success of a pitcher with limited big league exposure is ridiculous. Using saber-metrics to roughly predict the future success of an experienced big league pitcher is something I support. For pitchers such as Detwiler who aren’t too far removed from being a prospect scouting will tell you much more than statistics will. It’s not an either/or proposition it’s a both/and. I think everyone should use both scouting and saber-metrics when assessing a player.
Ross Detwiler will have a breakout year...Believe It!...and I'm serious this time!
by Pig.Pen on Feb 13, 2012 9:00 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Just for reference
Among the top 10 pitching staffs in 2011 (according to WAR), they used on average 8.6 SPs through the season. Most used 9-10. The Phillies and Rangers’ staffs were remarkably healthy and effective and they used the least number of SPs, which was still 7 each.
Considering the innings limit on Strasburg, the huge questions surrounding Wang’s health and durability, and that we’ve just traded almost our major league ready SP depth (in Milone and Peacock). I don’t think we’re in a very strong position to trade Lannan.
In a perfectly healthy season, we still need someone to start about 5-6 games in September for Strasburg. Without Lannan, that role falls to either Gorzelanny or Detwiler (who I presume will both be used as long relief)? The utility of two left handed long relievers is another story…
The problem is, there is no such thing as a perfectly healthy season. Of those top 10 pitching staffs, they used got on average 22.2 starts from guys not in their original 5 man rotation. I’d rather a bunch of those starts go to Lannan than some scrub like Maya.
The Nationals wouldn't be trading Lannan because he has no value to the club. They would be trading him because they could get more value out of him.
I completely agree that the Nationals will need someone from beyond the rotation to fill in. However, that does not mean that the value of Lannan over other options is greater than the value of a potential trade target.
Our current top 5:
Stras
Zimmermann
Gio
Jackson
Wang
Guys to draw 22.2 starts from:
Detwiler
Lannan
Gorz
Stammen
Maya
The question should be: Can the Nationals get more value from Lannan as a trade chip, than as a spot starter? To determine this, we would need to see the value added by having Lannan over Detwiler/Gorz/Stammen, and then compared that the value added from trade piece over the part being replaced.
To further complicate matters, is the question of salary. Could the club generate enough salary relief to sign a useful bench piece?
#extendZim
I think some of these questions are clear
What useful bench piece are currently available? None that I’m aware of (unless you like Manny Ramirez).
What is the market for SP? Nearly nonexistent. Why else would Scott Boras settle for a 1/$11mil contract, when he was originally seeking 5/$75mil?
The teams remaining who could use SP depth are very short on money. Lannan is neither cheap nor cost-effective. Roy Oswalt is a much more preferable option for apparently not too much more (last reports I heard, he was asking for about $8mil).
I don't think we are far apart on our positions.
I think the Nationals would be well served to acquire Matsui or Damon. Given that we use about 2 PHs a game, I see no reason why they wouldn’t be helpful for our terrible bench production.
I don’t understand the Jackson deal. But there are plenty of teams that could use a boost in the rotation, at a reasonable price. Next, I would remind you that Jackson cost twice as much as Lannan.
Finally, I would point out that Oswalt is being selective about where he wants to pitch, just like Jackson was. The Pirates offered him a much larger contract, but he didn’t want to pitch there. Oswalt doesn’t want to pitch in several places so he’ll take less money to pitch closer to home.
#extendZim
All signs point to
The Yanks trade Burnett and free up 6-7 million, which they use to turn around and sign Damon and/or Matsui.
Rob
--"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." -- Mal Reynolds
Is Damon serviceable at all in OF anymore? Or moreso a DH now? I have kinda liked the idea of Damon.
I think he would be extremely limited service in the OF.
He spent all of 84 innings there last yea. But hey they let Yuniesky Betancourt play short, so why not?
#extendZim
By the way,
243 plate appearances by pinch hitters last season, so around 1.5 pinch hitters per game.
Rob
--"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." -- Mal Reynolds
Curious, I sweat I had read that it was higher, closer to 1.77 or somthing. I must be going crazy
#extendZim
Could be the counting methodology.
If a pinch hitter stays in the game and plays a position, then the next time he comes to the plate it’s not “as a pinch hitter” (which was what I was looking at). Further, guys brought in on double switches do not bat as pinch hitters, and as all veterans of the first (and, to date, only) Federal Baseball Facepalm Guess’Em contest know, Riggleman in particular was big on double-switches!
Rob
--"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." -- Mal Reynolds
Also forgot to mention
I’m not necessarily opposed to trading Lannan, I’m just opposed to the idea that Lannan has to go. Based on the above quotes, where the Nats are basically offering him to anyone and everyone, it appears as if his exit is all but assured. I don’t think that has to be so.
I also think the SP market will be much stronger in July than right now. One playoff team is bound to lose their ace or #2, and be desperate for a quality innings eater. Maybe they’ll want a reinvigorated Wang or Jackson instead (since they’re both only on 1 year deals), and we can net some prospects or a decent CF….
I think Lannan would go because he has less to offer THIS team
Detwiler can be used in the swing role, where I wouldn’t want Lannan to be. Chubias mentions all the possibilities of spot starters and I don’t mind Detwiler, Gorzo, and one of Stammen, Maya or Meyers (he is coming back from the Yankees, I almost expect it) to make the 8 or nine guys required to fill in.
Name a number between three and five.
.............
.............
Threeve.
As with most trades, it all depends on who you get in return
I agree that the Nationals shouldn’t just give him away for nothing. But I don’t think that’s what they’re trying to do. Just because they are “aggressively shopping him” doesn’t mean they won’t wait until the right deal comes along. One thing I like a lot about Rizzo is his patience: he’s not jumping the gun on Harper, he isn’t jumping the gun on finding a CF, and I doubt he’d do the same with Lannan.
Chubias make a good point above that Lannan’s real value to the club is what he brings in spot starts/injury reserve over Detwiler/Gorzelanny/Maya. That suggests the Nationals shouldn’t need such great value to make the deal. Of course, you have to look at it objectively, too – he’s still a SP with a sub-4.00 ERA with 3 years of team control, so you should conceivably want a good amount more value than an upgrade over 5 spot starts.
I think you’re right when you say the market will be much better for him towards the deadline. Many teams seem to be happy with their rotation right now – when is that EVER true around the deadline? That’s how we stole Ramos from the Twins. The irony is that he’s also of more value to the Nats later on, as we get closer to Strasburg’s shutdown time. The real issue is what to do with him until then!
At this point he is a fair value
but the next arb $ makes him a non-tender, so years of cost control don’t mean too much
by William.Hatheway on Feb 11, 2012 6:48 AM EST up reply actions
Wang is in your top 5?
Lannan and Detwiler are better than Wang. HE should be the one they are looking to trade.
Rob
--"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." -- Mal Reynolds
Yeah. How did that happen?
Rob
--"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." -- Mal Reynolds
That's what always bugs me about Ladson
He had Wang #4 before the Jackson signing.
Aim for the head baby Jesus
As far as your Current Top 5.....
which I do agree with; however, how much better is Wang than Lannan RIGHT NOW? If at all? How “solid” is that #5?
I think that last spot is pretty squishy.
I think Wang could be set for a big come back year though. I would be ok with dealing Wang instead of Lannan though. He is also a million dollars cheaper, and so he might have more value.
#extendZim
What's he supposed to "come back" to?
He was always a very hittable pitcher, and he induces even fewer strikeouts than Lannan. He might be good for a 3.8 – 4.0 ERA, which is not very far from Lannan’s projection.
Rob
--"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." -- Mal Reynolds
So you know where I'm coming from
I tend to think of Wang as one of the most highly over-rated pitchers of our generation. It’s that Yankee/ESPN effect.
Rob
--"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." -- Mal Reynolds
He's never been a strikeout pitcher, but I think he could be up for a 3.5 ERA.
Assuming he can get his GB% into the 60s again.
For the record, I don’t think he’s significantly better than Lannan, but then despite my statements about trading Lannan, I am actually a big fan of Lannan. Perhaps I want to trade Lannan, because I am a fan, and overvalue him.
#extendZim
I like Wang over Lannan at #5 because of potential
Wang used to be the Yanks’ top pitcher. Granted, that was at a time where they had a real problem in their rotation. But still. If both Lannan and Wang are expecting a similar ERA, then I go with Wang because I know he’s capable of more, and at #5, I don’t mind take a chance.
Also don’t forget Wang put up those numbers pitching in the AL East.
Wins are an important statistic for evaluating a pitchers talent
*snark.
#extendZim
ERAs of 3.63 and 3.7
Those are dang good pitching in that division. I was a Yankee fan at the time and saw almost all of his starts. He was good.
also, he led the league in HR/9 in both those years
according to baseball-reference. IIRC the AL East has some power hitters. That’s impressive.
He seems to keep them in the park, that's true
Nevertheless, much of his hype is “wins-based” and ill-applied. He had incredible run-support — even more than the Yanks usually scored. For the record, only Boston and New York in the AL East featured above average offenses in 2007, his last good year. So, he wasn’t as challenged as some would have you believe.
Rob
--"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." -- Mal Reynolds
by RobBobS on Feb 10, 2012 4:24 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Yes, he was a good pitcher, but he was no where near the best pitcher in the league.
He got by with grounders and good defense behind him. I think he can do well again, but I don’t think he’s going to be under 3.5, which is what he would need to be significantly better than Lannan, who despite your claims that he has no upside has been quietly improving during his tenure in MLB.
#extendZim
And ARod and Cano
That’s a nightmare for a guy like Wang!
ARod has had only two above average seasons (out of 8) defensively at 3B.
Jeter is a well-known awful defender at SS.
Cano, another all-bat infielder (only one of seven seasons above average at 2B).
However, somehow Wang managed to excel in spite of these obstacles.
His upside is wayyyyyy better than Lannan’s. The likelihood of him achieving that is another story….
Fair
I still see Wang’s ceiling to be above Lannan’s. But Lannan’s a surer bet. It all goes down to what you value from the #5 spot, and where you think the organization is. Frankly I love them both at #5 right now. All things being equal (including potential trade returns) I say keep Wang, but I wouldn’t mind it the other way.
you don't get value from FA you just signed
if anyone else valued him higher they would have signed him. I don’t buy that this huge risk offered us a ton of “thank you” money for rehabbing him with pay…
by William.Hatheway on Feb 11, 2012 6:50 AM EST up reply actions
Early Spring is here!
acomak:
Some #nats pitchers have arrived RT @natsjackinfl: @acomak Jordan Zimmermann&Ross Detwiler this AM in Viera pic.twitter.com/mq00U33D
Yup
Detwiler looks poised for a breakout year, I can see it in his steely gaze through the chain-linked fence.
Ross Detwiler will have a breakout year...Believe It!...and I'm serious this time!
(he's serious this time)
Rob
--"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." -- Mal Reynolds
And that's not all
I hear he’s developing some sort of Cobra Kai leg kick to add to his delivery.
Ross Detwiler will have a breakout year...Believe It!...and I'm serious this time!
what's a million worth?
Gorzelanny at 3, Wang at 4, Lannan at 5. I don’t think Detwiler is going anywhere precisely because he has the most upside and they not dumping anyone they can get value out of for the next few years. Wang and Lannan are being paid close to what they’re worth, and the supply of starters is such that only teams like KC and Pittsburgh really could use them since they aren’t good destinations for free agents at present. Even so, they probably aren’t paying 4 or 5 million for one year of either and giving us anything back that’s useful, so what’s the point? Neither have never relieved in the majors, if it comes down to roster spots, Lannan is going to AAA, or someone goes on “extended spring training”. I see Gorzelanny having the most value because of this contract and versatility, but no one is talking about trading him.
I think Lannan could get dealt to Pittsburgh
The Nats might have to pick up a million or so of his contract, but you’re right FA’s don’t want to go to Pittsburgh and they could use a league average pitcher. Not sure what Pittsburgh would deal, but at this point Lannan will most likely need multiple injuries to SP’s to provide any value to the Nats so whatever they get for him will most likely be better than what they’ll use him for.
Ross Detwiler will have a breakout year...Believe It!...and I'm serious this time!
The idea of trading Lannan is fine
Its just hard finding good value for him in return. I am afraid we’d never quite be happy with the return.
You guys. You lollygag the ball around the infield. You lollygag your way down to first. You lollygag in and out of the dugout. You know what that makes you? Larry!
I think you have to be realistic with Lannan's new role on the club - $5M AAA starter
When you look at it from that perspective, it’s easy to be happy with the return. Essentially, if the Nats trade Lannan for a bag of balls and pick up $1M of his salary it’s as if they traded John Lannan for $4M.
Ross Detwiler will have a breakout year...Believe It!...and I'm serious this time!
Not if it allows them to add more salary next year.
If dumping Lannan this year allows for the Nats to lock Zimmerman long-term or at least contributes to that goal I’m all in favor of it.
Ross Detwiler will have a breakout year...Believe It!...and I'm serious this time!
Not now they can't
They went to arbitration with him before they signed Jackson, now Lannan is due guaranteed money so they’re paying him regardless.
Ross Detwiler will have a breakout year...Believe It!...and I'm serious this time!
I thought that they could release him after some number of weeks
Maybe at some point in April? Then they’d only owe him the pro-rated part.
Rob
--"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." -- Mal Reynolds
Not to my knowledge
As far as I understand it arbitration is binding and all big league contracts are guaranteed.
Ross Detwiler will have a breakout year...Believe It!...and I'm serious this time!
Here's what I found:
…The panel, without opinion, awards the player a one-year, non-guaranteed contract at one salary or the other. If the player is cut within 16 days before the season begins, he is entitled only to 30 days’ termination pay. If the player is cut during spring training but after the 16th day before the season begins, he is entitled only to 45 days’ termination pay.
Read more at Suite101: How Baseball Arbitration Works: MLB Rules Governing the Eligibility and Process of Arbitration | Suite101.com http://jameslincolnray.suite101.com/how-baseball-arbitration-works-a45599#ixzz1m1AdMzcW
Rob
--"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." -- Mal Reynolds
Understood.
I was referring to this year. They COULD decide to cut him instead of paying him $5M. But they won’t, because they offered him arbitration and a raise up to $5M in the first place.
Rob
--"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." -- Mal Reynolds
Pittsburgh has a fairly deep farm system when it comes to speedy OFs
The two that are probably MLB ready are Gorkys Hernandez and Starling Marte. Hernandez we could probably get from Lanann. The problem is his bat may never have enough power to stick in the MLB.
Marte hit .332 in his first run through AA at 22. He has a plus, plus arm, very good range in CF. He doesn’t walk much though, and he is an agressive hitter, so he’ll need some work with breaking balls, before he can be consider for a lead-off spot. I think that Pittsburgh would be willing to part with Marte, but they would need a sizable return. They have several good pitching prospects, but could really use some help at first and third. Unfortunately, I don’t think the Nationals have enough to get Marte.
#extendZim
Call me old fashioned
But I’m all for a defense-first CF as a stop-gap this year. So if they could get Hernandez it could be a good deal. Even if he hits .240 if he saves 10-15 runs a year with his defense the Nats may have the pitching to make up for his offensive shortcomings. Also, if they call up Harper in June or July your defense first CF can act as the late innings defensive replacement for Werth.
Ross Detwiler will have a breakout year...Believe It!...and I'm serious this time!
I would actually be interested to see if Chicago (or Boston) would move Bryd.
I think the Red Sox are among the best suitors for Lannan, but they don’t really have what we are looking for. I could see a 3 team trade going down, or Selig giving Boston Bryd as Theo compensation, then Boston trading Bryd for Lannan.
#extendZim
nope
Gorzy is cheap if you consider him as a starter, he’s kind of rehabilitated his value as a long man, and the Pirates may have fond memories of him.
How about Lannan + Whatever it Takes
to Pittsburgh for Andrew McCutchen. Depleting the farm system wouldn’t be too big a deal with McCutchen acquired (because I’m sure it’d take Lannan + multiple relevant Nats prospects) and Harper at least forecast to be ever day ready in 2013. The three OF spots would be locked up for several years.
#pipedream
by Andrew Davidson on Feb 10, 2012 3:36 PM EST reply actions
I firmly support this plan
If possible I would even throw in a couple of draft tickets, season tickets to the Phillies, Bob Carpenter and a player’s wife to be name later.
Ross Detwiler will have a breakout year...Believe It!...and I'm serious this time!
I took it to mean
Whatever it takes from the farm system. If I was overreaching there, than I withdraw my support of this plan.
Ross Detwiler will have a breakout year...Believe It!...and I'm serious this time!
Hence the #pipedream
I also don’t think trading a player’s wife is allowed, but maybe I could get a ruling on this? Perhaps if they signed Kris Benson?
Ross Detwiler will have a breakout year...Believe It!...and I'm serious this time!
It's a bit of a pipe dream, to be sure.
My guess is that at the minimum the name “Harper” comes up every time the name “McCutchen” comes up.
Rob
--"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." -- Mal Reynolds
I think Jones from the O's is a more realistic pickup
He is still young, but getting very expensive and the team is NO WHERE near competing yet. The O’s need prospects to help develop. Jones probably won’t stay in Baltimore, i.e. doesn’t sign an extension prior to FA.
The right package would be needed, but I think the Nats could give up just the right amount to get him.
Name a number between three and five.
.............
.............
Threeve.
they way overvalue that guy to everyone but the arbitrator
He’s pretty good, but they want superstar value back.
Also a pipedream
If the O’s wouldn’t deal Jones for Jurgens why in the name of all that is sanity would they deal him for Lannan unless that package is Rendon, Lombardozzi and Lannan.
Ross Detwiler will have a breakout year...Believe It!...and I'm serious this time!
they're up to their neck in mediocre options too
Lannan doesn’t really change that. Detwiler they might like, but with two more prospects that would decimate our system.
Also, Jones isn't great.
He is basically a corner OF that plays in CF. He doesn’t have the range to play CF, and as a corner OF, his bat is “ok” to “decent”.
#extendZim
I keep thinking that Jones will break out to stardom
He never does.
Rob
--"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." -- Mal Reynolds
by RobBobS on Feb 10, 2012 4:30 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Speed is over-rated anyway.
But I do think he can be a good, balanced player.
Rob
--"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." -- Mal Reynolds
That is awesome!!!
I love Bryce Harper. He may be cocky as hell, but he has light-tower power and isn’t scared to wear the black hat. His demeanor reminds me a bit of Teddy Ballgame and Barry Lamar Bonds. Lets just hope he plays like them.
Ross Detwiler will have a breakout year...Believe It!...and I'm serious this time!
I disagree on the demeanor comps
Williams and Bonds came off as surly. Harper is definitely not surly.
But I agree with the overall sentiment though!
Rob
--"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." -- Mal Reynolds
by RobBobS on Feb 10, 2012 4:28 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
True
They were both a bit more surly, but they both became more surly as they got older. Bonds was nearly as surly when he was a kid. Regardless, I was referring more towards their willingness to wear the black hat.
Ross Detwiler will have a breakout year...Believe It!...and I'm serious this time!
The ONLY reason I cringe a bit when I see some of the stuff Harper writes
is that it will feed into a media preconception that Harper is somehow an unpleasant fellow. While I say that Williams came off as surly, I mean that that’s what the local baseball writers said about him. And so they were hostile to him, and he naturally became hostile right back, and it only got worse over time.
That is NOT the future I want for Harper.
Rob
--"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." -- Mal Reynolds
That's the thing about twitter
athletes don’t need the beat writers the way they used to. Over the years I’m sure there have been hundreds of athletes that were portrayed by the press as not nice people just because they didn’t like talking to the press.
Aim for the head baby Jesus
Tiger Woods
Got all the love. Whoops.
You guys. You lollygag the ball around the infield. You lollygag your way down to first. You lollygag in and out of the dugout. You know what that makes you? Larry!
The media loves stories
Thats why they love to trash Hamilton, and why they supported Mickey Mantle, who literally drank himself to death. Its whatevers a convenient story at the time.
You guys. You lollygag the ball around the infield. You lollygag your way down to first. You lollygag in and out of the dugout. You know what that makes you? Larry!
A special request as you head to your regular friday night watering hole
if you could please remember to raise a glass for Xaiver Paul’s bat. Mr. Paul has consistently posted wRC+ of 115 or greater for the past 5 years in the minors. He has power there, SLG .463, .500, and .575. He walks some there 7%-8%.
And yet he has an MLB career slash of .246/.288/.341. Mr. Paul will turn 27 in a few days, and all he really wants is a break out year with the Nationals.
So, raise a glass or pour some out, to help the speedy OF solved the Nationals CF problem.
#extendZim
I'll drink to that.
(hic!)
Rob
--"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." -- Mal Reynolds
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